The Bullshidofication of Brazillian Jiujitsu

**Red Elvis** · Posted On: 11/24/2005 12:48pm

Originally Posted by BenwaMandelbrot

From your experience, what makes someone a bad player? Could they be categorized?

Bad is probably an incorrect term and an oversimplification. How I would classify this person getting passed would be that they weren't very athletic, they didn't try hard, they weren't progressing with their technique etc. Basically back then if your not tapping other blues and purples at all how could you be expected to become a purple? Unlike a McDojo, promotion would depend upon the ability to perform at the level expected of that belt. That is what made bjj different is that you couldn't earn a belt by time alone or by paying certain amounts of money. You had to be able to perform.

Now, I mention these things but please don't interpret that I agree with them. One of the things that pissed me off was the attitude that you needed to enter and win in competition to advance. I didn't have and still don't have much interest in competition. I wanted to learn it because it was fun as hell and because I could actually use it on the street in conjunction with my other MA's. (I had rowdy roommates and somehow back then we were always fighting.) I actually trained at a really good bjj school who's team does excellent in competition but I left because it was oriented only towards bjj competition not MMA or self defense application.

Originally Posted by Ronin

We really do have to take every individual situation as an individual situation.
Nowadays you CAN have BJJ Blue Belts tapping purples and browns, even possibly blacks, why?
Because of cross-over, a BJJ Blue could be a Judo 3 or 4th dan for all you know.

This is definitely true and is much more common today.

Originally Posted by Ronin

I think that, withholding BB to add the mystique of then meaning more than they do, is ALMOST as bad as giving them out like condoms at a high school, BOTH lead to McDojoism, one just takes longer than the other.

This was also the situation. Getting black was a huge deal then but in many cases long overdue. I will say though the difference was noticeable between what I would consider to be earned BB's (including way over earned BB's) and the "switched around instructors to get my BB" guys or the "went to __________ to get my BB" guys. There were places to go to get a BB faster and many took that route.

**Ronin** · Posted On: 11/24/2005 12:58pm

Originally Posted by RedElvis

Bad is probably an incorrect term and an oversimplification. How I would classify this person getting passed would be that they weren't very athletic, they didn't try hard, they weren't progressing with their technique etc. Basically back then if your not tapping other blues and purples at all how could you be expected to become a purple? Unlike a McDojo, promotion would depend upon the ability to perform at the level expected of that belt. That is what made bjj different is that you couldn't earn a belt by time alone or by paying certain amounts of money. You had to be able to perform.

Now, I mention these things but please don't interpret that I agree with them. One of the things that pissed me off was the attitude that you needed to enter and win in competition to advance. I didn't have and still don't have much interest in competition. I wanted to learn it because it was fun as hell and because I could actually use it on the street in conjunction with my other MA's. (I had rowdy roommates and somehow back then we were always fighting.) I actually trained at a really good bjj school who's team does excellent in competition but I left because it was oriented only towards bjj competition not MMA or self defense application.

This is definitely true and is much more common today.

This was also the situation. Getting black was a huge deal then but in many cases long overdue. I will say though the difference was noticeable between what I would consider to be earned BB's (including way over earned BB's) and the "switched around instructors to get my BB" guys or the "went to __________ to get my BB" guys. There were places to go to get a BB faster and many took that route.

Like you said, in many cases, it was long overdue.
But on purpose.
I mean 10 years to get a BB in BJJ would bascially make a BJJ BB an equal to a 3rd dan in Judo for example, technique wise, but the sheer amount of time in the art.

**DuckofDeath** · Posted On: 11/24/2005 1:23pm

Originally Posted by RedElvis

Actually they were K.G.

Who would G.S. be? PM me if you don't want to say and I'll tell you who K.G. is.

I thought you might have had the misfortune of being a disciple of the infamous Gene Simco, who "shopped around" for teachers who would give him his brown and black.

**Red Elvis** · Posted On: 11/24/2005 3:46pm

Bud Shi Dist - Here is your info:

Everybody else, please be respectful in any correspondance.

Joe Moreira:

JiuJitsu de Brazil
2990 Grace Lane
Costa Mesa, CA 92626

Telephone: 949-254-3554

joemoreira06@yahoo.com

http://www.joemoreira.tv/

Open 8am to 10pm, 7 days/week

** Also, have not verified this personally.

**BSDaemon** · Posted On: 11/24/2005 6:14pm

Red, you rock! It looks legit... So the package with my letter, highlighted evidence and commentary is on its way.

Joe is in Brazil right now but all this should be waiting for him when he returns. Now we just wait to see what his response is.

**Ronin** · Posted On: 11/25/2005 6:58am

His response may well be :

" you got a problem? how about we step onto the mat ? "

**Red Elvis** · Posted On: 11/25/2005 1:18pm

Originally Posted by Ronin

His response may well be :

" you got a problem? how about we step onto the mat ? "

Funny, when I read that for some reason I put a Brooklyn accent to it. Just need to add an (s) to you.

**Beneath Contempt** · Posted On: 11/27/2005 7:10pm

You know what's funny?

After bullshido got bored of this topic, it went tangentially crazy over at the previously maligned jjgear forum. Some brown belt disagreed with a purple over the topic at hand (whether or not low ranked people should be teaching). The brown claimed he couldn't be taught anything by the purple.

They threw down. met up and the purple subbed the brown in two minutes.

Yet again, the butterfly flaps it's wings in China, and two guys throwdown in the States.

Bullshido owns.

**BenwaMandelbrot** · Posted On: 11/27/2005 9:31pm

Well, I may as well say it.

BJJ WINS AGAIN!

**BSDaemon** · Posted On: 11/27/2005 9:42pm

BJJfighter.com wins again.

Not only does the man kick ass he's extremely eloquent, unlike the fuckstick he tapped. His writing were one of the posts that I sent to Joe Moreira.

If Joe Moreira wants me on the mat, I'm only like an hour away from him, so it wouldn't be out of the question. I wouldn't mind at all getting schooled by my grandmaster. But what would that prove except that a 6th degree BB can tap a lowly blue belt... but we already knew that right?