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  1. JFS USA is offline

    Converter of Virgins

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    Posted On:
    11/17/2005 3:01pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by geordiesteve
    BLAH ... BLAH BLAH ... BLAH BALH BLAH ...

    Hey, shitrat, instead of misrepresnting a MOD's position why don't you answer some questions regarding your "school" ... :biblethum

    How is it that claim your "school" is located at 22 Stowall Street ... but the only thing "there" is a Chartered Surveyor's Office? :dontknow:

    What days & times do you knobjockeys meet in whatever it is you meet in at the Stowall St. address for doing that **** you call KF? :karated:

    Since you haven't produced the "evidence" that will "bring down the house" and you don't know **** from shinola about the thread topic ... time for you to STFU and piss off ... KNOBJOCKEY. :new_astha
  2. JFS USA is offline

    Converter of Virgins

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    Posted On:
    11/17/2005 3:07pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Deluxe247
    Holy **** this thread is one of the longest I have ever seen here. Can someone summerize all this up for me? heh
    Dude, get with the fucking program ... cool? ANY thread I touch or Grace goes major huge ... all due to my refined sense of people skills, calm demeanor, charming wit, and gentle dispositon ... no doubt.

    As for summarizing ... EAT **** you goddamned fuktard :jerkit2yf ... it's been done at least once all ready so bag being such a lazy assed shitbag :spanky:

    And as you go through this day please remember ... Smile ... God Loves You ... everyone else thinks you're an asshole. :XXbuzzsaw
  3. JFS USA is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/17/2005 5:41pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Feryk
    And, although I'm showing my ignorance here, I had no idea what the form clips I looked at were trying to show. You say it's good kung fu, I'll believe you.

    But I sure as hell didn't get it. What I saw were a bunch of odd arm movements, and zero hip rotation. I'm sure it all has a point, but I'm too ignorant to see it. To me, it looked like any number of WC forms videos I've seen.
    Okay, reasonable so let's work through it a bit.

    You won't see rotational bio-mechanical force production as you typically understand and use it. You are looking for the hips & shoulders to link and rotate in a complimentary direction ... correct?

    The reason you won't see it is because the arcs have been significantly shortened.
    Makes sense to you or no?
  4. Cullion is offline
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    Everybody was Kung Fu fighting

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    Posted On:
    11/17/2005 6:29pm

    supporting member
     Style: Tai Chi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JFS USA
    The reason you won't see it is because the arcs have been significantly shortened.
    Makes sense to you or no?
    This confused me in Wing Chun for some time. I eventually got the impression that the power was supposed to be generated by an explosive shock from the bent rear leg (often whilst stepping towards the opponent, but not necessarily), moreso than a large rotation of the hips and shoulders (although the straight spine acting as a spindle in the tucked-in bowl of the pelvis was also utilised). I was never confident that I could knock somebody out with it.

    I get the impression that this 'short range power' where people are supposed to be able to hit hard with apparently much shorter but highly explosive movements are practiced in many southern chinese styles, but they're damn hard to do right (compared to the significant improvement in punching power I managed to make in a couple of months practicing to punch in a boxing-like way) and I think this is one reason why southern chinese MA are not yet representing the way I think they could in combat sports.
  5. Andrew -U.K is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/17/2005 6:45pm


     Style: Chen TaiJi ,SPM, Rou Quan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I eventually got the impression that the power was supposed to be generated by an explosive shock from the bent rear leg
    This would suggest to me, that you'd only got part of the solution. The solution is one of co-ordination. The 6 harmonies, or the TaiJi classics reference to the body as one family. Its a skill, its also transferable skill, something that translates accross any martial platform and IME to just about any physical activity if you so wish.

    tucked-in bowl of the pelvis
    Always thought of this as a red herring, its a training method mis-read as a fighting method. But hey, thats just my opinion.

    but they're damn hard to do right (compared to the significant improvement in punching power I managed to make in a couple of months practicing to punch in a boxing-like way)
    Yes and no, it requires more patience, and because its skill acquistion, some people don't see it as real 'training'. You can't blitz it, for me I had to swallow my pride and just keep on grinding. But when you get the feel for it, you appericate it and understand how its a useful skill. Plus with it being a skill there potentially isn't an upper level on its refinement.
  6. BenwaMandelbrot is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/17/2005 6:47pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ, Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yeah, it seemed to me that the strikes were, more often then not, combined with a step, and I initially didn't see anything resembling chain punches which are usually held up to be effectively useless in popular Bullshido canon.

    However, as I watched more of the clips, the one called 'tornado fist' did look a lot like chain punching. I also saw some exercises that were a lot like push hands, so it seems there's some similarity between WC and SPM.

    However, I don't really know enough about either to compare the two more than that. JFS, what do you consider the key differences are between WC and SPM punches? What other differences are there between the two styles?

    Some of you have been hit by JFS, so you have a better idea as to the actual effectiveness of SPM punches than I do. Care to share, those of you who have sparred with him?

    General observations (I was going to start a seperate thread on this, but what the hell).

    I liked the SPM stance much better than the WC stances I've seen and it looked nice and familiar. The kicks I saw were sparing and very WC-like.

    I really, really liked the speed of the movements. Those guys can move like, um, praying mantids when they feel like it. I also liked some of the grabs that these movements ended in and would be interested to see how they are applied in sparring.

    The thought occurred to me that some of the movements and concepts in SPM might make a really nice complement to BJJ, MT or boxing as providing a fast and agressive alternative to an MT or boxing clinch as well as a good entry to a standard clinch and takedowns where you would have dominant positioning from the beginning. I bet it would also give you a strong infighting game.

    I would definitely like to be able to move that quickly.
  7. JFS USA is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/17/2005 6:54pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cullion
    This confused me in Wing Chun for some time. I eventually got the impression that the power was supposed to be generated by an explosive shock from the bent rear leg (often whilst stepping towards the opponent, but not necessarily), moreso than a large rotation of the hips and shoulders (although the straight spine acting as a spindle in the tucked-in bowl of the pelvis was also utilised). I was never confident that I could knock somebody out with it.

    I get the impression that this 'short range power' where people are supposed to be able to hit hard with apparently much shorter but highly explosive movements are practiced in many southern chinese styles, but they're damn hard to do right (compared to the significant improvement in punching power I managed to make in a couple of months practicing to punch in a boxing-like way) and I think this is one reason why southern chinese MA are not yet representing the way I think they could in combat sports.
    Well ... fact is, most "short power" peeps can't do **** with their hand under anything like real pressure conditions. They "fa-jing" beautifully on empty air but can't get it together in the heat of the moment. Primarily a defect that arises from refusing to "repeatedly" walk through the Fire of full up pressure testing.

    If you were to use a "Slo-Mo" video analyzer you would discover that the longer arcs ... striking from a "cocked" position" is mostly wasted motion & energy. Post initial impulse there just isn't much in the way of acceleration. The extended span through empty space does not sum up to superior force of impact.

    What the longer arcs do is allow the person to stay in the movement path longer so they can get it together ... more representative of their comfort zone as opposed to bio-mechanical necessity.

    It's a matter of "shaping" and by this I mean slowly weaning a person off the requirement for extended movements. You can't just "get there" in one fell swoop as the reality of the matter runs counter intuitive and the Mind will undercut you every time ... confidence.

    I remember reading a study on American Football Punters years and it concluded - proved that fully 75% of their kicking motion was wasted movement. They tacked all the waste onto the backside of the impact with ball movement. Same deal only we tend to put all the waste into the front end of movement.
  8. JFS USA is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/17/2005 8:04pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Whussup kwanita? Did those fine peeps looking for you today finally find you? How's jayne's asshole coming along ... a bit puckered no doubt :5eek:

    Not to worry mate, it's going to get a lot worse for you two in the near future ... much, much worse. Enjoy! :angry4:
  9. geordiesteve is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/17/2005 8:38pm


     Style: SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JFS USA
    Whussup kwanita? Did those fine peeps looking for you today finally find you? How's jayne's asshole coming along ... a bit puckered no doubt :5eek:

    Not to worry mate, it's going to get a lot worse for you two in the near future ... much, much worse. Enjoy! :angry4:
    sorry jack.... your boyfriends don't seem to have found me... unless they dont know how to use a doorbell...
  10. ThaiMantis is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/17/2005 8:43pm


     Style: MuayThai & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    re

    Quote Originally Posted by BenwaMandelbrot

    General observations (I was going to start a seperate thread on this, but what the hell).

    I really, really liked the speed of the movements. Those guys can move like, um, praying mantids when they feel like it. I also liked some of the grabs that these movements ended in and would be interested to see how they are applied in sparring.

    The thought occurred to me that some of the movements and concepts in SPM might make a really nice complement to BJJ, MT or boxing as providing a fast and agressive alternative to an MT or boxing clinch as well as a good entry to a standard clinch and takedowns where you would have dominant positioning from the beginning. I bet it would also give you a strong infighting game.

    I would definitely like to be able to move that quickly.
    haha. i couldn't agree more.

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