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  1. lawdog is offline

    Middleweight

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,660

    Posted On:
    9/28/2005 11:07am

    supporting member
     Style: Judo & Boxing

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PirateNinja5000
    Interesting thread. So is the issue with creatine and caffeine specific to caffeine or to stimulants in general? I'm not snorting and 8ball or anything, but I do take ritalin for my ADHD and have been considering creatine since I mainly lift for my workouts.
    I'm no expert, Dakotajudo would probably know more regarding that. However, I believe the issue is the diuretic effect of caffeine, not it's stimulant effect. I've never heard of their being a problem with creatine and stimulants.
  2. Maestro Nobones is offline
    Maestro Nobones's Avatar

    rawr

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    736

    Posted On:
    9/28/2005 12:26pm

    supporting member
     Style: Mushin Dao, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Honor
    I'd recommend CEE but someone here would call bullshido on it...

    not me, it works great for me so far, and is much easier to take that monohydrate (dissolves completely instead of being silt at the bottom of the glass) and has caused NO gastrointestinal discomfort like mono did for me (the reason I stopped taking it).
    I think it was two ninjas taped together, to make one GIANT NINJA!!!!
  3. Tacitus is offline
    Tacitus's Avatar

    Lightweight

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    Apr 2005
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    165

    Posted On:
    10/04/2005 10:31pm

    supporting member
     Style: Crazy Monkey, BJJ, MT

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I was just wondering if anyone knows this: if caffeine has such a negative effect on creatine, then what about those supplements such as no-explode, nox cg, and all that. Those are all pretty packed with caffeine. I have been told that it's fine because it's not creatine monohydrate, and also that loading with that stuff is not needed, true, false, what?
  4. dakotajudo is offline
    dakotajudo's Avatar

    Judo Instructor

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    Jul 2002
    Location
    South Dakota
    Posts
    633

    Posted On:
    10/05/2005 6:19pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ames
    I was just wondering if anyone knows this: if caffeine has such a negative effect on creatine, then what about those supplements such as no-explode, nox cg, and all that. Those are all pretty packed with caffeine. I have been told that it's fine because it's not creatine monohydrate, and also that loading with that stuff is not needed, true, false, what?
    I checked out the no-explode - it doesn't look to have much creatine. Not sure what it's supposed to be good for. Some of the other ingredients might have ergogenic effects, but not so sure they complement creatine. One of the ingredients may even be a creatine uptake inhibitor (not sure, though, it's the beta form that's an inhibitor; the ingredient list doesn't say).

    The nox cg looks to be just creatine, arginine and glutamine.

    Regardless of the source of creatine, I would suspect that you need to load, to have any effect.

    Brought this up in class (exercise physiology) last week - professor says caffeine is not a powerful diuretic to be a problem with creatine. He's also pretty skeptical of the supplement industry in general (having worked for EAS). The no-explode sounds typical of the kind of thing he talks about - a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing. Some of the compounds, taken separately, may have desirable effects, but taken together in a mix like that? Who knows.

    Personally, I suspect supplement companies pick their ingredients based on how the mix can be hyped, and not on whether it may actually work. Caffeine works, creatine works, sure, why not throw them together! Arginine, too!

    As for caffeine v. creatine, I'd be more concerned with different energy systems activated by either creatine or caffeine; and that using both at once may cause one system to cancel out the other.

    Again, the important question is what kind of performance are you trying to improve?

    As for farm workers and coffee - that's pretty common, actually. Mom used to bring out a thermos of coffee for out afternoon (4 o'clock) lunch break - in the summer time, we had four meals - breakfast, dinner at noon, lunch at four, supper 'bout eight or nine - use of a lot of calories in a 12 hour day.

    And the benefits of caffeine in this case can be understood from what I've stated previously - caffeine boosts aerobic performance. Among other things, helps mobilize lipids, which are preferred in muscle at low exercise levels; and are pretty plentiful in those four-a-day meals - heavy on the meat and gravy. That's the secret of "farm strong".

    The caffeine may not affect hydration as much as expected - found one study that did not find a difference in hydration status after exercise, when comparing caffeinated and non-caffeinated sports drinks. Caffeine affects primarly water re-absorption, but that's not the only mechanism for retaining body fluids (which, as I got to thinking about it, is an argument that caffeine isn't going to affect creatine all that much, at least, not the diuretic effect of caffeine).
  5. BJJgirl is offline

    Registered Member

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    Oct 2005
    Location
    Silver Spring MD
    Posts
    30

    Posted On:
    10/09/2005 8:54am


     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I like coca cola. Even though it has caffine.
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