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  1. Ronin is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2005 9:00am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Shi Ja Quan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Neck breaks ?
    MMA?
    Ken Shamrock ?
    Marines ?

    What, no ninja stars ?

    Pathetic.
  2. Ronin is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2005 9:02am

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phrost

    Of course, Shamrock said there's a world of difference between fighting in a ring and fighting for your life in hand-to-hand combat.

    “The techniques have to be adapted to fit their needs,” Shamrock said. “The Marines are more in real life. When we fight in the UFC, it's on a nice clean mat. When the Marines fight, they're in the dirt, and it's not quite the same when bombs are going off and bullets are flying over your head. From the time you engage to the time you finish has got to be 3 to 5 seconds. You don't have much time. You either throw the opponent down or take them down with a body throw, and once they hit the ground, immediately snap the neck or knock them out. It's going to be clench, take down and finish quickly.”

    This just in !!
    The hand formed into a fist, is used in punching !!
  3. loki09789 is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2005 9:07am


     Style: Escrima/Kenpo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lucky Seven
    When marines fight they have automatic rifles, without ammo they can still be used as a weapon, without them they have handguns and even if they don't have either one, they have knifes, why are they learning hand to hand ? they will very rarely use those skills, besides the time and training you need to invest on them to be able to use them efficiently in a combat cenario its too much, I bet they don't train every day of the week on it.

    Just my 2 cents, but hey, they are the experts, they know what they are doing.
    No they don't but the USMCMA program is set up to work toward a few objectives not just as a way to train a fighting asset.

    It is an excellent tool to develop individual fighting spirit, it helps with overall conditioning, espirit de corps....

    Besides, don't you remember your Full Metal Jacket sound bites "It's a hard heart that kills" whether it is with a radio air strike, artillery, rifle, pistol (which isn't regular issue for everyone), knife (which may not be regulation or even allowed depending on the mission/mos - I know as an MP we couldn't carry the big nasties, but as an infantrymen we weren't even issued bayonets all the time either), or empty hand/rock....it is instilling the will/intent to use that force to accomplish the mission.
  4. loki09789 is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2005 9:08am


     Style: Escrima/Kenpo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by BatRonin
    This just in !!
    The hand formed into a fist, is used in punching !!
    Doesn't this quote from Shamrock also debunk the "no rules" BS of the early UFC advertising as well?
  5. Bluto Blutarsky is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2005 9:17am


     Style: Mostly drinking. E-chaun

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I still think bullshido should have a name list to honor fighters who do stuff like this.
  6. Ronin is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2005 10:10am

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     Style: Shi Ja Quan

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by loki09789
    Doesn't this quote from Shamrock also debunk the "no rules" BS of the early UFC advertising as well?
    I think Ken is refering to the "mindset" as opposed to the actual techniques.
    Going into a sport match with the goal of winning is very different than going behind enemy lines with the goal of killing.
    Even if you use the same techniques.
    Intent is everything.
  7. GarageJudokaSS is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2005 1:27pm


     Style: BJJ, Kickboxing, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    BatRonin and Loki both nailed it. It's about the "warrior mindset", which is the same thing that the new Army Combatives thing is going for... It's not about using leg kicks and spider guard on a Whacky Iraqi, it's about the will to fight, and getting over the feeling of the occasional adrenaline dump, and being able to think under pressure.

    We don't run the obstacle or confidence courses every day, despite the fact that we MAY have to run through tires, climb a net, and walk across a wet log to get to the nearest computer operated missile delivery system... But it's the team building and, really, FUN, that is the focus of those exercises.

    I think it's funny that Ken thinks he's one of the first instructors, though... Maybe one of the first big name ones, but my BJJ coach has done classes up there as well as for NSA and FBI for years, and USMCMACAPQLMONP is supposed to be older than the new Ary Combatives, and we've already got plenty of instructors for that.
  8. Sifu Stier is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2005 1:33pm


     Style: Shen Men Tao

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Bulldogs Rule!

    With all due respect to Mr. Shamrock and his many accomplishments.....as well as the value of his instruction...I sincerely doubt that combat Marines need his input to be 'dangerous' or to secure a proper 'mindset' in the field!!!
    Last edited by Sifu Stier; 9/21/2005 1:37pm at .
  9. Zid is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2005 2:21pm


     Style: None as of yet

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lucky Seven
    they have knifes, why are they learning hand to hand?
    Doesn't knife fighting count as hand to hand combat? I think MAs would be useful in that case.


    I'm just glad that the marines are learning MMAs rather than goddamn TKD.
  10. DerAuslander is offline
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    Valiant Monk of Booze & War

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    Posted On:
    9/21/2005 3:28pm

    supporting memberstaff
     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Irony of ironies, I've read several articles about the General who started the overhall of the old Marine LINES hand to hand program that eventually lead to the new MCMAP.

    He was inspired by the ROK Marines' Taekwondo training program during his time in Korea, and you don't **** with ROK Marines.

    My little sister's ex-boyfriend is a MCMAP instructor. Real hard dude. Nice guy, real gentleman, would even go grocery shopping for my mom and help her around the house. My sister has dated some real losers in her time, and she finally brought home a guy I approved of...

    So what does she do?

    Dump him and start dating some dude in a band...
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