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  1. hl1978 is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2005 12:50pm


     Style: Aunkai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cullion
    DakotaJudo made an interesting point:

    "But are they good because they've trained 100+ mile weeks. or can only the good runners survive 100+ miles weeks? Is it an improvement or a selection process."

    I've often wondered if there's an element of this in which arts appear to produce the best results when tested open competition. I.E. Are the average MT practitioners good because there training has given them the most improvement, or is the training 'selecting' people who were the best fighters ?

    You'd have to collect and compare dropout rates to tournament results to try and isolate the 'improvement' component.

    I wonder if the arts generally accepted as being most practical are actually the ones offering the best 'improvement'.

    Am I making sense ?

    I have often thought along the same lines myself.

    My own take on it is that if one trains hard, and realsitically (or alive as people here refer to it), I dont see why any style can't be effective. the thing is since a lot of styles/schools don't seem to be doing that, there aren't many examples for comparasion.

    So, as you proposed, is it the techniques or the practicioners?

    Maybe another way to look at it is to compare it to colleges.

    Are MIT graduates good because MIT made them good, or are they good because they are highly intelligent to begin with and the "lesser" students were weeded out by SAT scores and tough classes?

    I am really not sure how to compare this, unless you can somehow convince more schools to train realistically. This of course would likely reduce their finanical incentive to do so.
  2. Ronin is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2005 12:51pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Shi Ja Quan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cullion
    DakotaJudo made an interesting point:

    "But are they good because they've trained 100+ mile weeks. or can only the good runners survive 100+ miles weeks? Is it an improvement or a selection process."

    I've often wondered if there's an element of this in which arts appear to produce the best results when tested open competition. I.E. Are the average MT practitioners good because there training has given them the most improvement, or is the training 'selecting' people who were the best fighters ?

    You'd have to collect and compare dropout rates to tournament results to try and isolate the 'improvement' component.

    I wonder if the arts generally accepted as being most practical are actually the ones offering the best 'improvement'.

    Am I making sense ?

    It is and always has been, a combination of both.
  3. JFS USA is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2005 12:53pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cullion
    I've often wondered if there's an element of this in which arts appear to produce the best results when tested open competition. I.E. Are the average MT practitioners good because there training has given them the most improvement, or is the training 'selecting' people who were the best fighters ?
    Age old Nature v. Nurture argument. If we look to the former USSR and Soviet Bloc Countries we have examples of highly controlled selection ... genetic based.

    One of the main problems with evaluating their training methods centers on chemical enhancement. I'm thinking of the East German Women's Swim Team.

    I wonder if the arts generally accepted as being most practical are actually the ones offering the best 'improvement'.
    You have to define terms, Cullion. Start with "Improvement" ... how is it quantified ... is the starting baseline constant within the group being examined ... it quickly gets very complicated. That's one reason, marketing hype aside, why there are so many competing training systems within any given physical activity.

    I seriously doubt there will ever emerge a "the best" model ... there is great variance in the Human Condition ... even within Children of the same biological Parents.

    During the height of the "Cold War" vast sums of money went into uncovering the most efficacious training method(s). The matter has yet to be decided.

    That's not to say there aren't some reasonable parameters in place that hold "true" across a wide range of individuals. Hopefully that is what this thread will explore. John
  4. JFS USA is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2005 2:09pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hello Peter:

    Might be a decent working model to start with:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...str&query_hl=2
  5. Phrost is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/30/2005 2:14pm

    Business Class Supporting Memberstaff
     Guy Who Pays the Bills and Gets the Death Threats Style: MMA (Retired)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I haven't been paying attention to any of this, but did you say you were an 18x JFS? Disagreements or no, if true, that would be worthy of a custom title.
  6. JFS USA is offline

    Converter of Virgins

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2005 4:13pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    EDIT: No more "freebies" for avatars.

    If you make a claim of being in a position to "check" into any thing I post then I call Bullshido on you. Prove you are in any position to verify or deny the issue raised. Provide proof you have the skill/ability/knowledge to interpret or obtain the information you profess to be able to access.

    Bullshido, where claims are checked out ... certainly ... the claim that a person is a reasonable source for information pertaining to a claim made by another is subject to the same standard. After all, the information is only as good as the source. :new_321: John
    Last edited by JFS USA; 8/31/2005 12:55pm at .
  7. Phrost is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/30/2005 4:20pm

    Business Class Supporting Memberstaff
     Guy Who Pays the Bills and Gets the Death Threats Style: MMA (Retired)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Regardless, if all that's legit the title serves to point out your subject matter expertise in the respective field. It's not an ego thing or an award, just an identifier.
  8. JohnnyCache is offline
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    All Out of Bubblegum

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2005 4:23pm

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yeah, it's so that every time you mention it, and someone goes "Prove it" you can say "I proved it last time it got brought up now STFU."

    And we all know how much you love saying STFU.
    There's no choice but to confront you, to engage you, to erase you. I've gone to great lengths to expand my threshold of pain. I will use my mistakes against you. There's no other choice.
  9. JFS USA is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2005 5:54pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Phrost
    Regardless, if all that's legit the title serves to point out your subject matter expertise in the respective field. It's not an ego thing or an award, just an identifier.
    Lost me ... just how is being awarded the title of "Asshole" make me an expert ...

    Oh, you mean the Army thing. This isn't the place for small arms discussions and I wouldn't engage in one if it were brought up. I left Bragg years ago and as I drove off of it for the last time I didn't even glance in the rear view mirror. That was then and now it is today. There are young studs in Group today that would run circles around me on my best day their worst. Talk to them.

    No, I'm not putting up my DD214, my SSN, my Credit Card Number, or saying where I hide the spare keys to my car.

    I've decided that since the "sharp shooting" peeps are content and allowed to hide behind bullshit avatars, when my full, complete, personal information inclusive of telephone number and street address were put up on Bullshido ... I owe none of you anything.

    Anonymous peeps that like to ask detailed questions need to overcome the perception hurdle ... that they are cowards.

    My life, my information and I'll share or hold back as I so desire. Got a "problem" with anything I claim ... guess what ... it's just that ... your problem. Fix it or live with it. John
  10. JFS USA is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/30/2005 5:56pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyCache
    And we all know how much you love saying STFU.
    Yes, indeed I do, JC. I learned that here ... on Bullshido. That in of itself was well worth the $20. Now JC ... STFU. :laughing7 John
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