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  1. plasmagoat is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2005 6:22am


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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by locu5
    Thank you for replying. Perhaps the deficiency in my understanding of your point comes from reading comprehension issues; it is also possible that your point is so ephemeral that it defies actual description. My understanding of your point is:

    "MA is about politeness in my opinion. People here are not being polite and this means they are not being good martial artists. Everyone here is being rude to me, no matter the fact that I am more moral and smarter."

    Is that a fair assessment?
    No, it's actually completely incorrect, but it's obvious that people here might benefit from politeness.

    By what right do you claim moral and intellectual superiority? Please delineate the actions, achievements, and words that demonstrate this. Or is this also simply your opinion?
    Moral superiority: completely uncivilized, unreasonable and unacceptable behavior is accepted, encouraged and supported here.
    Intellectual superiority: you actually try to argue in favor of such behavior, and you don't do it very well.

    Your style field says you do not do MA; you said yourself your MA experience is not worth mentioning, ergo it may as well not exist.
    It exists, it just isn't worth mentioning.

    It matters because you are trying to state your opinion on what a martial artist should be, from the outside. This is as tenuous a position as me trying to tell professional wrestlers that they should not act silly so much because it demeans the sport.
    I'm stating how I'd like martial artists to ideally be and how I'd like to be/am myself. I am not stating how martial artists should be, or how they factually are in reality.

    Have you considered actually taking a good martial art and experiencing what MA is really about?
    Oh, please tell me what it's really about. I'm sure I'll immediately abandon my values and beliefs as soon as I discover that martial artists really are just violent drunks, and that I should be one too. I'm sure I'll have to start drinking in order to learn how to do a roundhouse kick.

    I understand that you want to defend yourself against these horrid attackers of your point of view. While that is commendable, you seem to lack the tools to do this in either a martial or spoken context. That is OK, part of growing up is learning from people who know more than you do, as a significant number of posters here do in both the martial context and in others.

    What would you like to learn about?
    I know perfectly well that the average Bullshido user knows more than I do about the MA, but that is completely irrelevant, and constantly appealing to it will not magically make it more relevant. I mean ****, this is like claiming that I can't favor black boxing gloves in training because I don't have the experience to understand that the gloves should really be pink.
  2. Locu5 is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/28/2005 6:37am

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     Style: Alliance BJJ (Blue)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by plasmagoat
    No, it's actually completely incorrect, but it's obvious that people here might benefit from politeness.
    OK, fair enough. What is your point exactly, since no one seems to get it?


    Moral superiority: completely uncivilized, unreasonable and unacceptable behavior is accepted, encouraged and supported here.
    Intellectual superiority: you actually try to argue in favor of such behavior, and you don't do it very well.
    But you too are engaging in uncivil behavior with spamming, swearing, and your general tone. How does this give you moral superiority? Your response to intellectual superiority is a non sequitur. By what right do you claim intellectual superiority?

    I'm stating how I'd like martial artists to ideally be and how I'd like to be/am myself. I am not stating how martial artists should be, or how they factually are in reality.
    And herein lies the issue, by your actions and insistence, you appear to be trying to demonstrate your viewpoint is correct and should be adopted by others. If this is not the case, why are you still arguing its validity as if it were a fact?

    Oh, please tell me what it's really about. I'm sure I'll immediately abandon my values and beliefs as soon as I discover that martial artists really are just violent drunks, and that I should be one too. I'm sure I'll have to start drinking in order to learn how to do a roundhouse kick.
    Your sarcasm is unwarranted here and goes back to what I said about moral superiority; you are not winning anyone over with this. Martial arts are about fighting; everything else is ancillary.

    I know perfectly well that the average Bullshido user knows more than I do about the MA, but that is completely irrelevant, and constantly appealing to it will not magically make it more relevant. I mean ****, this is like claiming that I can't favor black boxing gloves in training because I don't have the experience to understand that the gloves should really be pink.
    To use your analogy, you are telling the same person that they are wrong because of their belief that pink gloves are the correct, based on the pink glove’s demonstrated benefits. Additionally, that would assume you have some martial experience, which you do not. The relevance, as I tried to state using the pro wrestling analogy, is that martial experience alone can teach what a martial artist should be. You lack this.

    We can go around and around with this to no resolution for 12 more pages, or we can try to reach a consensus. What would you like?
  3. pox is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2005 6:37am


     Style: Kenpo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by plasmagoat
    No, it's actually completely incorrect
    and there's the problem. No-one here seems to understand what you're saying.
    Either every single person who posts on bullshido has serious problems with reading comprehension, or you can't express yourself. At all.

    Which do you think it is?
  4. plasmagoat is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2005 7:14am


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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by locu5
    OK, fair enough. What is your point exactly, since no one seems to get it?
    Ready? Here it comes: I personally attach certain values to the martial arts. They're my values and I don't expect anyone else to follow them or associate them with the martial arts or anything else. I don't claim that they're objective values that everyone follows or should follow, but I think it would be nice if they were an essential part of the martial arts. If that isn't provocative enough for a 50 page flamewar, nothing is!

    But you too are engaging in uncivil behavior with spamming, swearing, and your general tone. How does this give you moral superiority?
    Like I've said many times before, it's impossible for me or probably anyone else to reach the level of JFS & co when it comes to uncivil behavior. I'm simply getting more and more irritated because people insist on dragging this on and defending JFS' obnoxious behavior. JFS immediately flipped out for no reason and remained that way, while I gradually became angry because of the unreasonable attitude of Bullshido. There's the difference.

    I was making a point with the spamming, and I succeeded. When KFDW spams images, it's accepted and ok. When I do the same, it's not ok. Double standards.

    Your response to intellectual superiority is a non sequitur. By what right do you claim intellectual superiority?
    Hmm? I already explained it.


    And herein lies the issue, by your actions and insistence, you appear to be trying to demonstrate your viewpoint is correct and should be adopted by others. If this is not the case, why are you still arguing its validity as if it were a fact?
    Are you just pretending to be stupid to troll me, or are you for real? I just explained how my viewpoint is not objectively correct, and that I'm not trying to force it on anyone! I've explained it a hundred times already in various different ways.

    Your sarcasm is unwarranted here and goes back to what I said about moral superiority; you are not winning anyone over with this. Martial arts are about fighting; everything else is ancillary.
    I've never claimed that they aren't about fighting.

    To use your analogy, you are telling the same person that they are wrong because of their belief that pink gloves are the correct, based on the pink glove’s demonstrated benefits. Additionally, that would assume you have some martial experience, which you do not. The relevance, as I tried to state using the pro wrestling analogy, is that martial experience alone can teach what a martial artist should be. You lack this.
    Oh, so now there's something specific that a martial artist should be, something that's objectively correct? Didn't you just accuse me of forcing my opinion on everyone else? Didn't you (and a lot of other people) also say that martial arts is only about fighting?

    We can go around and around with this to no resolution for 12 more pages, or we can try to reach a consensus. What would you like?
    A concensus cannot be reached because people ignore what I say on purpose, and make things too complicated or twist them into something that they're not.

    Quote Originally Posted by pox
    and there's the problem. No-one here seems to understand what you're saying.
    Either every single person who posts on bullshido has serious problems with reading comprehension, or you can't express yourself. At all.

    Which do you think it is?
    I guess it just proves that I'm intellectually superior.
  5. JohnnyCache is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/28/2005 7:23am

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     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hey, you know what? You don't have to be a douche back to us. If you're so intellectually superior, why don't you prove it, by like, not blithering and crying.

    This is not a college student union. You do not have the right not to be offended or screwed with here.
    There's no choice but to confront you, to engage you, to erase you. I've gone to great lengths to expand my threshold of pain. I will use my mistakes against you. There's no other choice.
  6. plasmagoat is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2005 7:24am


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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyCache
    Hey, you know what? You don't have to be a douche back to us. If you're so intellectually superior, why don't you prove it, by like, not blithering and crying.
    Oh yeah, you guys really have the authority and credibility to say that to someone. Really.
  7. loki09789 is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2005 7:29am


     Style: Escrima/Kenpo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyCache

    This is not a college student union. You do not have the right not to be offended or screwed with here.
    So....you should expect to be offended and screwed with here?

    That is the problem. Go after artists and systems that are making BS claims,

    but there is a difference between saying "your wrong" or something like that and then backing it up with some kind of support

    AND

    saying "I'm right and rational because I say so and I say so because I'm right and rational"...and then 'defending' your position with the Fbombs and "fat bastard" insults that don't prove anything you say is right or add to the topic. All it does is show how undisciplined people are when they can hide behind a keyboard.
  8. JohnnyCache is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/28/2005 7:30am

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     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What. The. ****.

    It's not a matter of authority. In the grownup world no one tells you how mature to act. They just yell at you for fucking up.

    See, you don't get a lot of what's going on here. You think you do, but you don't. JFS, for example, just isn't quite how you think he is. He's easy to take wrong, but he's more like R. Lee Ermy then Andrew Dice Clay, if that makes any sense.

    What I'm saying is if you're so smart, how come all you can think of to do is whine and cry and drop to the level of your detractors?

    And if your ego and intellect are so superior, how come their immune to rigorous error checking? One thing that good complex system has is the ability to maintain under stress.

    Also, are you sure you don't just have sand or other grit in your vagina?
    There's no choice but to confront you, to engage you, to erase you. I've gone to great lengths to expand my threshold of pain. I will use my mistakes against you. There's no other choice.
  9. plasmagoat is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2005 7:32am


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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyCache
    What. The. ****.

    It's not a matter of authority. In the grownup world no one tells you how mature to act. They just yell at you for fucking up.

    See, you don't get a lot of what's going on here. You think you do, but you don't. JFS, for example, just isn't quite how you think he is. He's easy to take wrong, but he's more like R. Lee Ermy then Andrew Dice Clay, if that makes any sense.
    I know perfectly well what JFS is, he has made it abundantly clear.

    What I'm saying is if you're so smart, how come all you can think of to do is whine and cry and drop to the level of your detractors?
    It's just not possible to drop to the level of JFS or KFDW. Not possible.

    And if your ego and intellect are so superior, how come their immune to rigorous error checking? One thing that good complex system has is the ability to maintain under stress.
    What kind of error checking?

    Also, are you sure you don't just have sand or other grit in your vagina?
    Well, I don't have a vagina, so I'm pretty sure there's no sand there.
  10. Locu5 is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/28/2005 7:32am

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     Style: Alliance BJJ (Blue)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    OK, instead of point by point, which is getting a bit messy, I will reply without quoting. Your words and actions are inconsistent.

    You say: This is my opinion.
    You do: You try to force this opinion on others by telling them how they should or should not act.

    You say: I am morally superior.
    You do: You post with sarcasm and insults to anyone who questions you, regardless of tone.

    You say: There are double standards.
    You do: You claim moral superiority while using the previously noted sarcasm and insult.

    You say: I am intellectually superior.
    You do: Your posts are anything but intellectual; they have the insight and depth one would expect form a young boy. You use arguments that are opinion and feeling based, without facts.

    You say: MAs should be polite.
    You do: Curse, insult, demean, etc

    You say: Martial arts art about fighting. (good for you)
    You do: Assign additional attributes that a martial artist should have.

    You say: JFS is an asshole. (No ****, thanks for pointing it out)
    You do: Act as close to JFS as you are able without being blatantly hostile. You use passive-aggressive and patronizing words/tones to replace the vulgarity, but in the end, how different is it?

    You say: No consensus can be reach because everyone here is intentionally misinterpreting you.
    You do: Continue to post the same thoughts over and over ad infinitum and misinterpret (intentionally?) the words others say to you.


    To be honest I am having a hard time understanding the disconnect between your words and actions. I think this disconnect is the primary reason why people are having a hard time taking you seriously, and hence treating you like a troll. You are coming across like a child with injured pride trying to justify to adults why they are wrong. I really think you are taking this way too personally and seriously. You need to relax a bit. Training in martial arts can help this.

    Why will you not train in a martial art?

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