Originally Posted by polishillusion
How you can support a guy who think he is Kenshin I can't understand.
Thanks for coming on Bullshido. Post something in n00bieville.
You love making wild inferences and conclusions from everything I say. I am not saying Master Ochiai is the only martial artist in the world that knows how to drop someone with one punch. I was just stating the reason why we stop at each point and don't just keep wailing on somebody in a tournament. Do you think the majority of everyone studying Martial Arts in the US can take someone out with one punch like MMA, K-1 and western boxers can? That is what I meant. I guess I have to spell everything out to avoid your comebacks, but that is probably not possible! :-)
Let the sparring continue!
Do you realize how rare it is to knock someone out with just one punch?
Originally Posted by Steveni
That is why people train combinations. Most times they get slightly dazed and you need to hit them again.
soooo, your admitting that one of the two black belts you were going to send to Mike is a terrible sparrer? (as i can infer by your excuse of he WAS good and not talking anymore) and that hes just as good as you? making you what? i dont want to insult you, your just saying it, and i hate seeing ppl insult themselves, you deserve better. actually, i dont even blame Bowen for turning old or gray around the ears, but when a TKD guy can look at someone once supposedly "so great" and laugh at a HAND TECHNIQUE when TKD is mostly legs, then there is problem. and this guy is a head super duper instructor with textbooks with his pictures in them, and saying how Ochai would just promote him randomly from dan to dan when meeting Japanese socialietes for money, etc etc etc..........
and again i state - the washin ryu binghamton university club use school and personal money to go to HIDY OCHAI HIMSELF AT HIS DOJO at LEAST 3 times a week to train. My friends **** themselves because they get such am incredible "privilage". they sold me CANDY, and i can quote a new transfer from the DDR club saying "Peter, wont you buy candy from the club you can beat the **** out of?" and i felt so sorry that they had to ask me like that i broke a 20 and took all 17 in change they had in the collection cup. im starting to wonder if i want my money back........
and i again i state, these guys are close personal friends, we dont just " just spar", we have the ability to meet outside of class, to talk, and to actually bend rules the club doesnt to really access how certain techniques would work. im sorry, but if you think that "one punch will work" idea in "real life" then you have never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever seen or been in a real fight. If i had to get up to 6th dan in a martial art and pay $10000000000 to be able to defend myself via that idea, i would have probably been dead years ago when i did get into actual fights. look at videos of Ochais two sons fighting (since he does sell them to people for almost $50 bucks a pop, and the club did buy one), they hit each other constantly, in the face, granted they have armor of sort on. but, they looked like insane streetfighters with their flailing arms and "punching"...... they even have baby videos of Ochai training his sons to spar HIM at events, and its cute of hell, but i just dont see why there is a $50 video of it at his dojo to buy.....
Whats the use of a martial art if it takes 10 years to learn how to defend yourself if you need it NOW? TKD, you can basically learn to block, punch and get out of a situation the FIRST DAY, granted you might not be good enough. Washin Ryu got aggravating because they made even the simpliest and most basic technique look like it was the "super forbidden five finger heart exploding technique"......
to make an even stronger point, the one thing that drove me over the edge, was that they actually REFUSED to promote me to yellow tip (belt, i dont care) because at the time i did not have the MONEY to pay for a uniform, when i have a perfectly fine set of tkd pants, and i could have borrowed a top from a friend. my ability obviously was there, but the $$$$$$$ wasnt. ive never ever experienced something like that before...even after my family lost all its income and there were several deaths, my TKD master demanded i came for FREE, and would even give me money to come to train with him because i had to take the bus or subway to reach him...... and Ochai's student wouldnt promote me because i had no money? im sorry, but **** that. Martial arts can be used to sustain you, but if you expect to make enough to gloat about how both of your sons are high ranked non-profit buisness men and doctors, then youve missed the point, regardless if you make that much or not.
Originally Posted by polishillusion
Point. Peter. Winner Peter.
Loser Steven. Penalty : Kill yourself :seppuku:
You guys are tough . He is my sempai, so I have to respect him and not say I am a better sparrer.
I did not say I could drop someone with one punch or that it was easy. But there are people that can do it and that was my understanding why we stop after one full punch. you may do a combination, but the last punch is meant to "finish" your opponent.
So the bottom line is that you believe the Binghamton club sucks. Can we move on from there, stop insulting people and get the discussion back to the history of Hidy Ochiai?
I don't have anything to offer on that besides what has already been stated on this thread.
"But there are people that can do it and that was my understanding why we stop after one full punch. you may do a combination, but the last punch is meant to "finish" your opponent."
Again, just to clarify before we can hopefully move past this, I am talking about point sparring. I assume that is what you were doing at the club and did not have a real fight with everyone there. So if you do point sparring with a Washin ryu student, we will stop after scoring a point. In a tournament, the official would yell "YAME" when a point is scored.
If you are asking me if Mr. Bowen is the best sparrer in Washin Ryu, the answer is no. There are many strong sparrers that actively spar in tournaments. I don't think Mr. Bowen has competed for some time. You are looking one or two branches on the tree and judging the whole tree if I can use that analogy.
If you would like to come to Owego to meet me and talk about this any Thursday at 7:30, please let me know.
Is there any rule in Washin Ryu against real sparring?
your not getting it..... i meet with these kids out of club or training. no rules, only friends teaching each other. **** the concept of one punch, stopping or anything. we are a bunch of 20-22 year old guys, and we would beat the **** out of each other and teach each other. we never got seriously hurt, we have more control then that (at least i did). ONCE A REAL WORLD SITUATION AROSE WITH THE WASHIN RYU STUDENTS THEY WOULD CRUMBLE. thats the POINT. i would be messing with my GOOD FRIENDS, i would say, grab a shirt, or a hand, and say, "so, how do you get out of this?" i would hold on firmly, like a real attacker. and guess what! they couldnt!
no, i did not ONLY say the Binghamton club sucks....ive seen them be explioted for money over and over and over, and if they actually got results, i wouldnt complain, but money and no results is disgusting....... ill say it over and over..... im not even much of a fighter anymore, but when a basic boxing technique like STEPPING OUT OF THE WAY can throw a monkey wrench into someones entire technique, then there is a problem. i see a very stark combination of terrible teaching and money being laundered away from the university.
i would never ever be as crude as to just blatently say that my own friends are terrible, disgusting and stupid martial artists, because i know they are not. they are honestly trying their best at this technique, its just the very system which is supposed to be transforming them into WARRIORS is turning them into SHOWDOGS. They have NO CONCEPT of how to finish an attack, how to actually strike. They go to this "dojo", and come back with hurt noses and hands, because of the lack of real control in the sparring. the fake sparring hurts them a LOT more then real sparring would ever, because in REAL sparring you learn how to NOT hurt someone if you had the choice, it forces you to learn control because you dont have a sparring partner if you dont.
and im sorry,but the HEAD ASSISTANT OF THE HEAD MASTER OF THE SCHOOL SHOULD BE A GOOD INDICATION OF THE HEALTH OF THE ENTIRE TREE OF THE MARTIAL ART. OCHAI STARTED THE MARTIAL ART! HE NAMED IT! BOWEN WAS HIS FIRST AMERICAN STUDENT! HIS STUDENTS SHOULD BE THE EPITOME OF WHAT THE MARTIAL ART SIGNIFIES!
your trying to make it seem like this is some wierd branch out in utah where they just got videoes online and copy it. NO. this is the HEAD OFFICE! where the HEAD MASTER TEACHES!
the POINT is - its a fucking MONEY MACHINE WHICH IS IMMORAL BECAUSE IT DOESNT ACTUALLY GIVE PEOPLE WHAT THEY PAY FOR!
I pray i am around to help my friends the day they need to use Washin Ryu to save their lives.... so i can be there to help them not get hurt.
Sorry, I did not understand that is what you meant. Mr. Bowen was not his first American student as far as I know. If you are referring to Mr. Bowen as the head master, I have to disagree. He is the leader of a club. Master Ochiai is the only head master. I am also surprised that Mr. Bowen would hold a candy drive?? Are you sure it was to raise money for the club? That sounds strange.
No promoting you without a gi also sounds strange. I never require my students in Owego to buy a gi. They can wear their belt over their clothes or not wear it at all. There is just a $20 charge for the promotion. I have let many kids take the class for free if I know their parents don't work. I have given students gi's and have not charged them for promotions if they simply don't have the money.
It sounds like you know your stuff and at 20 years old are probably very fast.
Congratulations on your progress.