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  1. CanucKyokushin is offline

    He'll flip ya!

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    Posted On:
    7/22/2005 8:50am

    supporting member
     Style: Not.....working

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If I can add my two cents;I visited a friends wing-chun (thats how it's spelled)school the other day.I couldn't help but notice how many young people were there.I mean most were in the late teens early 20's.I thought,cool!This is a happening place.But I think thats it in-fact.Wing-chun is more appealing to the young crowd because it somehow seems cool or the **** to them.I think it has to do with Hollywood constantly rehashing this style.

    And hey!If they are learning how to defend-themselves then that's great.I could think of a number of styles that could be more effective,but tht means joining a smelly gym or old Dojo.There is nothing appealing about an old Dojo filled with people of various ages to a young person.
    Last edited by CanucKyokushin; 7/22/2005 8:53am at .
  2. WingChun Lawyer is offline
    WingChun Lawyer's Avatar

    Modesty forbids more.

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    Posted On:
    7/22/2005 9:27am

    supporting member
     Style: Muay Thai, BJJ newbie.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Oh, for chrissake.

    Look, Wing Chun has its merits. But in the majority of WC schools, it lacks a lot of essential striking techniques (such as jab, cross, and hook), as well as a lot of necessary practices (sparring, conditioning, heavy bag work).

    MT schools, on average, are much better. People who enter a MT gym usually want to learn how to fight; people who enter a WC school usually want to become Bruce Lee. Different things.
    That civilisation may not sink,
    Its great battle lost,
    Quiet the dog, tether the pony
    To a distant post;
    Our master Caesar is in the tent
    Where the maps are spread,
    His eyes fixed upon nothing,
    A hand under his head.


    - W.B. Yeats
  3. The_Mirth is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    7/22/2005 9:31am


     Style: WC, Shotokan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It doesn't take long to go from here.
    Quote Originally Posted by leejunfan
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by The_Mirth
    Ugh, 1 two year old post + 1 post that's basically the same as posts 2 years ago + 9 posts of STFU = no more "my REAL _ing _un is th3 d34dly threads" for gods sake! I've only been reading this board for a short time and allready these circular logic threads are giving me the runs.

    are we forcing you to read it?
    to here.
    Quote Originally Posted by leejunfan
    I don't understand why someone has to come in here and start comparing mainstream WC to MT, BJJ or anything. It's so tiring and boring. Yeah I know.... I'm not being forced to read this but it still cracks me up.
    I know where you're coming from but considering the number of people who have come and talked about how badass _ing_un is I can't see there being any point to talking about it on this board without some evidence that it is an effective style.

    In the other thread about subjectivism someone had a little chart of MA rankings
    1)Proven
    2)Questionable
    3)Bullshido

    I think _ing_un is sitting squarely in questionable due to its compareably long time to produce proficient self defense to other styles. Having any posts on the subject to convince otherwise without someone with a UFC/PRIDE etc. record or someone going to a throwdown and impressing someone with the actual system is just going to get flamed imho.

    edit:changed "fighters" to "self-defense".
    Last edited by The_Mirth; 7/22/2005 9:52am at .
  4. VikingPower is offline
    VikingPower's Avatar

    Yes Koto got his name changed, quit asking...

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    Posted On:
    7/22/2005 9:48am

    supporting member
     Style: Kyokushin Karate

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by bncwd
    Italy.

    Try to explain, speaking of basic punches: strenght comes from the ground/stance, but in a different way than boxing. In boxing for i.e. a cross or a jab you turn the foot, leg, hip torso and shoulder in order to put weight on the punch.

    In WT the stance aligns internally shoulder, back, hips, knee and foot and the body just "falls" a little bit upfront: this leads to advancing and putting in any kind of blow the sum of the different body parts effort plus the advancing.

    In boxing you have a turning / spiral momentum, maybe helped with an advancing step in WT you have a bottom upwards momentum transferred with a slight advanicng/falling step.

    They are both effective if properly trained (problem is boxers work a lot on heavy bags, WTnners usually don't, so the technique comes out shitty), but with the WT one process you need much less movement to put weight on the punch, and no stance preparation at all.

    I can assure you that the WT punch if properly done is a really heavy one.

    Problem is, again, that many WT practitioners only do "shadow WT", in the air, while you need to train like a boxer in order to make that kind of hit effective.
    So you're implying that Wing Chunners get more of their weight into their strikes than boxers? You should read my article to see how boxers really punch, then :bduh:
  5. leejunfan is offline

    Wing Chun Instructor

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    Posted On:
    7/22/2005 6:16pm


     Style: fighting

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    LOL.... I don't really care what anyone thinks of WC, MT, BJJ or whatever. I like them all and have an open mind. I don't judge a system.... I judge the person. I have seen MT'ers get their butts handed to them by TMA's. Did it make me think MT sucks?..... nope.

    oh well....
  6. Jekyll is offline
    Jekyll's Avatar

    .

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    Posted On:
    7/22/2005 6:30pm

    supporting member
     Style: San shou(tai chi) +judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by leejunfan
    .... but we haven't seen samurai swordsman in there either. Get my meaning?
    Is it that Wing Chun is practiced exclusively by a heriditary class of paper pushers, who should have been burried several centuries ago and that even if you were carrying swords the vast majority of you could be savagely beaten down by a 14 year old with a big stick?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stickx
    It must suck for legit practitioners of tai chi like Cullion to see their art get all watered down into exercise for seniors.
    Those who esteme qi have no strength. ~ Exposition of Insights into the Thirteen Postures Attrib: Wu Yuxiang founder of Wu style tai chi.
  7. WT5000 is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    7/22/2005 6:59pm


     Style: WT and BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I know WT is hard to explain and most of that is probably due to all the different ways of performing the WT skills. So my question is why do you all try to explain WT? I know I couldnt explain it well and I practice it. Oh and we do heavy bag work and conditioning too, dont remember who said WT doesnt have that, but some of us do.
    Plus we spar all the time and occasionaly bring in guys from other styles to spar with, but yeah so far I have noticed that the WT core curriculum is lacking in ground work. Thats why I do BJJ too.
    The only really good __ng __unners are in Europe, the best guys here are like the equivalent of a first BB. At most.
  8. EternalRage is offline
    EternalRage's Avatar

    WARNING: BJJ may cause airway obstruction.

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    Posted On:
    7/23/2005 12:22am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Bajillion Joo Jizzu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Its main strength it's that it gives you really useful tools to use in a real "life situation": imo no other arts gives you the opportunity to strike first, quick and effectively as WT. I am thinking about i.e. a situation in which your are standing in a bar and someone suddendly start to get aggressive: with WT you have the best thing to attack before the other has even started moving, and that's key to achieve "victory" in every non-ring situation.
    This is the exact type of thinking that gets me snickering at WC. What you just described is like the nicest "real life" experience you can possibly get. Try walking down the street at night while a masked attacker comes up behind you and pistol whips you while his friends drag your woman away into a car. You gonna bil jee the barrel of the gun?

    Too many WC schools preach this best effective self defense crap and WC would fare no better in any of those situations than any other system. And you're saying you have to learn it in 6-7 years? Also, analogies are supposed to link two different sets of variables that share the same connection. Katana vs. knife is no way related to MT vs WC.

    Let me tell you what I found wrong with WC. The system is based too much on efficiency derived from science and principles. Sure all those principles hold true during its application, but the opponent will be so random that it doesn't matter that all their movements follow a set of rules because although they are bound to certain limitations in the physical realm, they are not inhibited from using the full range of what they are physically allowed in a random and rapid manner.

    That's the main problem I had with WC. I wanted to torque my hips. I wanted to commit more weight distribution to help out with power issues.

    Bleh on with the flaming already I've been waiting for a _ing _un thread for weeks.
  9. The_Mirth is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/23/2005 12:29am


     Style: WC, Shotokan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by leejunfan
    LOL.... I don't really care what anyone thinks of WC, MT, BJJ or whatever. I like them all and have an open mind. I don't judge a system.... I judge the person. I have seen MT'ers get their butts handed to them by TMA's. Did it make me think MT sucks?..... nope.

    oh well....
    And a lot of anecdotal evidence of the people involved in this forum implies that the overwhelming majority of morons seem to pick _ing _un as their MA of choice. Then multiply it by the fact that everyone that practices _ing _un seems to disagree with what it is/isn't or how their lineage is superior to everyone elses. I haven't seen a lot of Xing Yi or Mantis guys come on here and talk about how bad ass they are or what not. TKD has a pretty rough rap but this is tempered by the tkd guys who do kickboxing. Since this site is all about put up or shut up _ing _un is going to be written off until it puts up. I really enjoy the _ing _un I'm learning, I think its a blast but the number of morons who come here and talk about it seem to ruin it for anyone wanting to talk about the valuable aspects of the art.

    I'm not even sure what you're asking I just assume you're asking why _ing _un threads are almost instantly flamed and I threw out a guess.
  10. Equipoise is offline
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    Certified Fitness Trainer

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    Posted On:
    7/23/2005 2:12am

    supporting member
     Style: Chemical Assistance

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    **** the knife, gimme a gun.
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