Taking up a new system

**fusenshi** · Posted On: 7/13/2005 1:08pm

Little background first.

I started out taking Karate as a teenager. Figured out, later on, that it was far too commercialized (at least the school I was in), so I left that. I trained in boxing, kickboxing, and limited Muy Thai for a few years. I took up and started training in the Bujinkan system about 6 years ago. I really like the system as it taught me a new way to think about fighting (such as positioning, timing, balance, mixing soft/hard, breaking, etc), and it really challenged me to think and move outside the box. I really love the system as it gives me some out of the box tools to apply to the other styles that I had learned.

After lurking here for a couple of days, I decided that I need to incorporate a grappling system in order to round myself out. A friend of mine is a wrestling coach, so he is going to teach me wrestling techniques, and I am going to teach him stuff from my martial arts background.

Do you guys think the wrestling will give a good foundation for groundfighting? I think I can incorporate those principles with what I know of locks, pressure points, etc. and round things out a bit. Has anyone gone this route, and if so, what should I expect?

**JKDChick** · Posted On: 7/13/2005 1:17pm

Getting occasional wrestling training and mixing it with *choke giggle* ninjutsu is gonna be HUGELY effective, yeah.

Actually, I don't know. It would all depend on the skill of the teacher and your natural talent. It might be all you need. But I doubt it.

Can any of the wrestlers chime in?

**fusenshi** · Posted On: 7/13/2005 1:28pm

Originally Posted by JKDChick

Getting occasional wrestling training and mixing it with *choke giggle* ninjutsu is gonna be HUGELY effective, yeah.

Actually, I don't know. It would all depend on the skill of the teacher and your natural talent. It might be all you need. But I doubt it.

Can any of the wrestlers chime in?

Choke and giggle ninjutsu? I seriously don't understand why this system gets such a bad rap here.

**JKDChick** · Posted On: 7/13/2005 1:31pm

Because it's not real?

Oh, look, I don't really mean to flame you. You might be in a great school, I don't know. I just have this thing about ninjutsu.

**fusenshi** · Posted On: 7/13/2005 1:36pm

Originally Posted by JKDChick

Because it's not real?

Oh, look, I don't really mean to flame you. You might be in a great school, I don't know. I just have this thing about ninjutsu.

Hey, its all good. I have been to seminars in the Bujinkan and trained with instructors and students, and sit back and think that "These people would be seriously injured in a real fight". A lot of schools teach this tip tap, soft form of ninjutsu. Their students move at a snails pace, analyze every move, etc etc. Not real fighters.

My instructor practically beats the **** out you of during class. He doesn't focus on all the really flashy (read ineffective) stuff that would never work against resistence. Just nit and grit, practical techniques.

My point is, its not all bad. You have to find an instructor who isn't caught up in all the hype.

**Kistrael** · Posted On: 7/13/2005 2:06pm

Everybody here has a thing about ninjitsu. Good thing you can roll with it, Fusen, because not everybody is so kind about it.

Welcome to Bullshido.

**Yrkoon9** · Posted On: 7/13/2005 2:19pm

Learn wrestling.

But you have to incorporate it into live sparring, while trying to incorporate your previous experience in order to fully gauge your ability though. If your friend is a wrestling coach it is not enough for him to teach you 'techniques'. You will need to constantly drill them, and then actually WRESTLE.

But if you mention locks and pressure points again I will have to flame the fucking **** out of you.

**_Mick_** · Posted On: 7/13/2005 2:20pm

Originally Posted by fusenshi

Hey, its all good. I have been to seminars in the Bujinkan and trained with instructors and students, and sit back and think that "These people would be seriously injured in a real fight". A lot of schools teach this tip tap, soft form of ninjutsu. Their students move at a snails pace, analyze every move, etc etc. Not real fighters.

My instructor practically beats the **** out you of during class. He doesn't focus on all the really flashy (read ineffective) stuff that would never work against resistence. Just nit and grit, practical techniques.

My point is, its not all bad. You have to find an instructor who isn't caught up in all the hype.

look out everybody! he has the real ninjitsu.

as for wrestling. it will increase your balance, and give you strong takedowns. on the ground you will learn dominant positions, but no submissions. (im assuming is freestyle or folk style wrestling)

**TakeAnother** · Posted On: 7/13/2005 2:24pm

Originally Posted by fusenshi

My instructor practically beats the **** out you of during class. He doesn't focus on all the really flashy (read ineffective) stuff that would never work against resistence. Just nit and grit, practical techniques.

Why does every Ninja say this? Do a search and indulge yourself in many of the long reads about what is wrong with Taijutsu.

Ironically, every Bunjikan member always states that most Ninjas are ineffective fighters, however, they are part of the select few that know the REAL Taijutsu. And they all come and post here...

Wrestling will not be enough. While offering excellent takedown and positioning skills, you'll be lacking the submission/submission defense skills. Call me a cynic, but I don't think your Ninja training will give you those submission skills. If you don't believe me, enroll in a formal BJJ/MMA/Judo program.