Can sports karate fight at all?

**jungle-mania** · Posted On: 7/09/2005 9:16pm

I have been sparring a number of sports karatekas from traditional japanese karate background during my 12 years in martial arts. Aside from KK and Okinawan Karate, the other bunch of karate fighters just don't meet the mark at all with the limitation of the semi contact.

I think the techniques they use are effective and the speed they develop is good, but both are rendered useless because of their light contact ruling. Has anyone here done or met anyone who has actually able to do Jap karate at full contact level? I like to know. Have a friend doing sports karate and I don't like the idea of him being creamed all the time by other martial artists.

**TehDeadlyDimMak** · Posted On: 7/09/2005 9:28pm

My personal opinion is that Sports Karate will make one a better fighter than the Average Joe on the street and they'll be competitive against students of other schools that employ light/no contact rules. (which is actually quite a lot of students) However, if he/she come across anyone that's trained for realistic combat (hard sparring, weight lifting, cross training etc.) they'll be effectively doomed. That's just an opinion from personal experience.

**Wounded Ronin** · Posted On: 7/09/2005 9:37pm

Generally speaking, krotty guys are destroyed by boxing or muay thai. This is because usually their sparring, if it even exists in the first place, is really borked.

**patfromlogan** · Posted On: 7/09/2005 9:49pm

Originally Posted by Wounded Ronin

Generally speaking, krotty guys are destroyed by boxing or muay thai. This is because usually their sparring, if it even exists in the first place, is really borked.

Ah, that really depends. I work out with a non Bullshido amerikan eclectic sport krotty school that spars lots, light to medium contact. Though true we do take it to the ground (and restrict it to wrestling then w/o strikes) and sometimes the contact gets pretty hard, specially if patfromlogan is pissed! But neverless the bbs spar fast and with competence and while they might suffer against good muai thai (**** I sure have! Let me tell you about my 10 second match against a 22 yr old mt Thai guy-the real thing, vet of the ring in Thailand-split me like a spear) they would kick the legs out from under the average moron on the streets, and toss 'em on their heads.

**drillpogodrill** · Posted On: 7/10/2005 6:31pm

It's been a while, but I used to spar with a lot of sport karate tap-sparring guys. I would say most of them would get beat down in a barfight. Why? because of the false sense of distance that type of sparring gives. you can just bowl over them with wild haymakers or bullrush them and they go down. Obviously, any live sparring will help, but if you NEVER get banged around, and more importantly, PUSHED around in class, you are at a disadvantage not only against a trained guy but anyone who fights at all.

**JOHN DOE** · Posted On: 7/10/2005 10:29pm

Sport Karate is good for the speed and movement. You need to bang and grapple. At our school we start with sparring for a warm up then we put on the boxing gloves. Its kinda fun to watch a sport karate guy fight a kick boxer. Usually they extend out there hands when they take a shot or two. At that point you know they are done.

**jungle-mania** · Posted On: 7/10/2005 11:03pm

But if they went full contact with the techniques they are using right now? Can they still be effective? It was fun to bounce their head here and there last time and kicking them from the waist down, but it is get kinda sad to see them being crumpled up all the time. I never even bother to go to the ground with them, the fight always ends before that comes about.

**Poop Loops** · Posted On: 7/10/2005 11:07pm

Yes, if they went full contact they would be FORCED to use good techniques, whether they be what they are learning or something else.

I mean, a punch is a punch, right? It's just that Kickboxers and such actually punch and get punch, whereas most sport karateka just go through the movement.

PL

**Zeddy** · Posted On: 7/10/2005 11:53pm

I think PL is essentially correct. In my change from TMA to MMA, it was fairly obvious some techniques get thrown out, some get cleaned up, and some retained.

Examples:

- If I don't switch to kick with my lead leg I still use a snap kick that's fairly similar to my TMA days.

- Back leg kicks have changed to MT round kicks mainly.

- My standup guard has become a lot tighter and closer in. Since we tend more towards the slug than the dart in, touch and dart out, it needs to be.

**jungle-mania** · Posted On: 7/11/2005 12:44am

Looks like karate might have lost their deadliness. I wonder who will be the next Mas Oyama to kickstart the next revolution in karate. I have heard that there is alot of politics and breakoff in the barknuckle karate scene.