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  1. Cullion is offline
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    Everybody was Kung Fu fighting

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    Mar 2005
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    Oxford, UK
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    Posted On:
    7/04/2005 2:32am

    supporting member
     Style: Tai Chi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Kistrael
    Has there actually been any record of people using tai chi chuan to fight? No, seriously, I want to know.
    Have a look at the last few pages of the 'Why don't Internal Arts fight in the UFC' thread. I posted a link to some vids from a Tai Chi school that regularly enters San Shou comps (and wins), and has a student with an OK record on Sherdog for Vale Tudo.

    A bullshido member, Liokault, studies Tai Chi at a school in the same association, and is a former British San Shou champion.
  2. Locu5 is offline
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    Zombie Herald

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    Feb 2004
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    Atlanta, GA
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    Posted On:
    7/04/2005 4:27am

    supporting member
     Style: Alliance BJJ (Blue)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Whenever I yield, or move my partner into the space I once occupied, I use my tai chi. Whenever I feel my partner's body, I use my tai chi. Whenever I swim my hands/arms through my partner's, I use my tai chi. Hell, I would argue any time I slow down my breathing consciously mid-fight, I am using my tai chi. On off days when I need to loosen up the old joints and get the blood moving, I do my tai chi.

    I am just a hobbyist. SM is better qualified to talk about tai chi RE: competition fighting.
  3. pazman is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    7/04/2005 9:50am


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Poop-Loops
    Isn't Chen's dad sane about Tai Chi? Like, he just claims it's body mechanics and not fancy "chi" stuff?

    PL
    I have no idea about William C. C. Chen but I attended a seminar run by a teacher under him back in my University days. It was very down to earth and practical training. In fact I don't think he even mentioned 'qi' once, which was great...I think CMAists need to get away from those old-timey sorts of terms, it confuses the hippies.
  4. Bang! is offline
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    Light Heavyweight

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    Posted On:
    7/04/2005 10:08am

    supporting memberBullshido Newbie
     Style: Wu Style TCC + BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    A student once asked my sifu about moving someone without touching them. After a few moments of grave contemplation, he looked up and said, “You want me to show you? I’ll show you.” He had anothery person lock the door and dim the lights. “Come closer and hold your palms out.” The first guy stood right in front of him as he closed his eyes and began to meditate. The atmosphere was charged and no one dared move. After several moments, my sifu opened his eyes and began to breathe audibly, moving his hands slowly toward the other guy. At the last moment, he shouted with surprising volume, jolting the guy out of his reverie and causing him to jump back at least a foot. “There you go,” he said giggling, and went back into his office.
    Last edited by Bang!; 7/04/2005 3:23pm at .
  5. Ronin is offline

    Merry Christmas Bitch

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    Sep 2003
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    Canada
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    Posted On:
    7/04/2005 10:34am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Canadian Shidokan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Poop-Loops
    Yoda would totally ruin your teacher's ****. He'd be like "Yours Up." and then force push him off of a cliff.

    PL
    That little green fucker has an attitude problem.
  6. Ronin is offline

    Merry Christmas Bitch

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    Posted On:
    7/04/2005 10:35am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Canadian Shidokan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Repulsive Monkey
    Someone once asked my sifu about moving someone without touching them. After a few moments of grave contemplation, he looked up and said, “You want me to show you? I’ll show you.” He had someone lock the door and dim the lights. “Come closer and hold your palms out.” The guy stood right in front of him as he closed his eyes and began to meditate. The atmosphere was charged and no one dared move. After several moments, my sifu opened his eyes and began to breathe audibly, moving his hands slowly toward the other guy. At the last moment, he shouted with surprising volume, jolting the guy out of his reverie and causing him to jump back at least a foot. “There you go,” he said giggling, and went back into his office.
    He's lucky your sifu didn't kick him in the nads, just for shits and giggles.
  7. Gezere is offline
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    My guns bigger than Scrapper's!

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    10,587

    Posted On:
    7/04/2005 11:28am

    supporting member
     Style: Kakutogi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Repulsive Monkey
    Someone once asked my sifu about moving someone without touching them. After a few moments of grave contemplation, he looked up and said, “You want me to show you? I’ll show you.” He had someone lock the door and dim the lights. “Come closer and hold your palms out.” The guy stood right in front of him as he closed his eyes and began to meditate. The atmosphere was charged and no one dared move. After several moments, my sifu opened his eyes and began to breathe audibly, moving his hands slowly toward the other guy. At the last moment, he shouted with surprising volume, jolting the guy out of his reverie and causing him to jump back at least a foot. “There you go,” he said giggling, and went back into his office.

    LOL! Your Sifu has a sense of humor.

    When I was in Korea I was really hamming up in TKD class. I was constantly throwing HADOKENs and SHORYUKENs at pple. My Sabunim came up when I was going to do HADOKEN at someone and he said he was going to show me how its REALLY done. I was thinking, OH **** ITS REAL! He drew back and posed for awhile to gather is CHI. Then he shouted and threw his hands out... then a raguet ball hit me in the head. :icon_conf Then he said get back to practise and stop goofing off. (Which was a silly thing to say because the next week I switched to Fatal Fury attacks)




    On the Taiji / Kickboxing thing I don't thing some of you guys don't understand why pple are downing the notion.

    Taji, Bagua, Xing Yi are all very distinct forms of MA which characteristic movements and techniques. However when you see the SPARRING IMA clips they are just kickboxing and doesn't resemble the art. When a MT person fights it looks like MT, when a Boxer figths its looks like boxing, when TKD "fight" it looks like TKD. So why doesn't the IMA look like IMA when they are doing SanShou? The whole, "They have punches and kicks too" is BS. I am not saying the IMA will look exactly like the forms when fighting but one should be able to see the distinctiveness of the art.
    ______
    Xiao Ao Jiang Hu Zhi Dong Fang Bu Bai (Laughing Proud Warrior Invincible Asia) Dark Emperor of Baji!!!

    RIP SOLDIER

    Didn't anyone ever tell him a fat man could never be a ninja
    -Gene, GODHAND

    You can't practice Judo just to win a Judo Match! You practice so that no matter what happens, you can win using Judo!
    The key to fighting two men at once is to be much tougher than both of them.
    -Daniel Tosh
  8. Bang! is offline
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    Light Heavyweight

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    Posted On:
    7/04/2005 1:00pm

    supporting memberBullshido Newbie
     Style: Wu Style TCC + BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You make some good points, but I have to say that I've been trying to do a bit of san shou-style training (There's a competition in September that I'm so far from being ready for, it's ridiculous) and have found that the equipment itself changes things dramatically. Wearing boxing gloves negates a lot of our hand strikes and a huge percentage of our defensive options. These aren't just techniques, either, as a lot of what we do is predicated on sensitivity -- usually stemming from hand contact. There's no question that the result looks a whole lot more like kickboxing -- albeit with low kicks -- just based on that.

    But I also want to say that I don't do anything as stylized as Chen Style. I think of my stuff as almost an add-on to any other type of training. It's a level of depth when it comes to looseness and sensitivity that could almost be superimposed on top of any style and doesn't really have a look of its own, outside of some very subtle mechanics and being very conservative when it comes to commitment of force and balance.

    I would wager that one of the reasons for such "stylized" movements from so many people comes from a lack of understanding the percentages when it comes to certain techniques. However, anyone with ring experience is going to develop from a base of higher-percentage stuff. It's not that these things don't exist in each of these arts, it's just that they aren't given an equivalent emphasis in form work, or even drilling. They also don't look as cool . . . Ah, there's half of the problem with TMAs right there.

    I definitely belive that, after developing a solid base, more "signature" applications can be included in one's arsenal. I don't know if I'll ever be able to prove that personally, because I suck at striking -- it just doesn't come naturally to me. However, I've made a bit of headway with grappling. Although I now have some experience with BJJ, my stand-up is pure tai chi and -- despite still being a bit rough -- should be identifiable as such.
  9. Lampa is offline
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    Middleweight

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    May 2004
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    Oceanside, NY
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    1,288

    Posted On:
    7/04/2005 1:17pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     New York MMA Examiner Style: magic FUCKING powers!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by EVIL ASIA
    LOL! Your Sifu has a sense of humor.

    When I was in Korea I was really hamming up in TKD class. I was constantly throwing HADOKENs and SHORYUKENs at pple. My Sabunim came up when I was going to do HADOKEN at someone and he said he was going to show me how its REALLY done. I was thinking, OH **** ITS REAL! He drew back and posed for awhile to gather is CHI. Then he shouted and threw his hands out... then a raguet ball hit me in the head. :icon_conf Then he said get back to practise and stop goofing off. (Which was a silly thing to say because the next week I switched to Fatal Fury attacks)




    On the Taiji / Kickboxing thing I don't thing some of you guys don't understand why pple are downing the notion.

    Taji, Bagua, Xing Yi are all very distinct forms of MA which characteristic movements and techniques. However when you see the SPARRING IMA clips they are just kickboxing and doesn't resemble the art. When a MT person fights it looks like MT, when a Boxer figths its looks like boxing, when TKD "fight" it looks like TKD. So why doesn't the IMA look like IMA when they are doing SanShou? The whole, "They have punches and kicks too" is BS. I am not saying the IMA will look exactly like the forms when fighting but one should be able to see the distinctiveness of the art.

    I've been meaning to ask you about something related to this.

    When I saw the clip of you doing stand up against Luan in one of the throwdown vids (took me long enough to see it, I guess) you would hold your arms slightly out from the side and stalk up to him some kind of irate gorrilla. Then you hit him with some neat hits where it appeared your shoulder was the point of contact. Everyone once in a while you would switch up and assume a stance that was more familiar to me where your hands were up.

    Was the "irate gorrilla" entry and shoulder strike something out of baji or were you just messing around with things? Would you use that kind of approach in a more serious competition? It seemed really strange to me, but I know this side of dick about most CMAs.
  10. liokault is offline

    Moron

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    Oxford UK
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    Posted On:
    7/04/2005 2:01pm


     Style: Tai Chi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cullion

    A bullshido member, Liokault, studies Tai Chi at a school in the same association, and is a former British San Shou champion.

    Your going to be so disapointed if you meet me, when you see what a sad fat bastard I have become since fucking my knee up just over a year ago!

    As for Max Chen, yes he is a great san shou player, yes his dad is a great Tai Chi teacher (from what I read), but he dont do his dads tai chi for the san shou. I hear that hes mostly into boxing.
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