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  1. Te No Kage! is offline
    Te No Kage!'s Avatar

    Chemist

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    Posted On:
    6/23/2005 10:50am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ/Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    dude, train at American Top Team if you get a chance, real self defence, real "alive" training and you'll know for certain where you're at in your skill by sparring at full tilt in every class. If you take Hapkido/Aikido/Hapkiyusool/Daito-ryu, you'll learn a lot of techniques that you won't know if will be able to work or not when the time arises. Start with a good base art like Judo/Muay Thai/BJJ and then if it's not for you or you want to dabble in something else, fine. But as a martial arts noob, you'd be best served by taking one of those three. If you still don't want to take our advice, take some free classes at each school and decide for yourself.
    "Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration." -A. Lincoln

    Vote your conscience.... Vote Libertarian!
      #11
  2. Te No Kage! is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/23/2005 11:02am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ/Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    BTW the last three pages are the best for info
    "Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration." -A. Lincoln

    Vote your conscience.... Vote Libertarian!
      #12
  3. hapkido_keith is offline
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    Crappler Extraordinaire

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    Posted On:
    6/23/2005 11:14am

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     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I DO hapkido, and I would recomend Judo or BJJ.
      #13
  4. punchingdummy is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/23/2005 11:26am

    Join us... or die
     Style: TSK

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by torrefaction
    I actually did read this whole thread, and that's the reason I'm posting. After 38 pages of random people saying different things, I wasn't sure what the verdict is. From what I gathered, Deluxe never actually went to the school. So did someone find out for sure that this is more of an Aikido focused school than Hapkido?
    I tried to be pretty thorough. I read all the threads he (Jeff Allen) posted on here, and some on Budoseek (Where he seemed to have a certain amount of respect, and . From what I saw, when people called to check his references, what they got out of it was that he was well respected, and a skilled instructor. But I did notice a lot of what seemed like double-talk to me. I really am not trying to stir up the pot here, I wanted someone's honest opinion of hapkido, and then to see if anyone had actually been to that school. I'm just really wanting to take training seriously at this point in my life, and I don't want to end up at a less than top notch school.
    You are asking compund questions - you want to know about Hapkido AND Mr. Allen. I would suggest that you would be less confused if you focused on one at a time.
    Last edited by punchingdummy; 6/23/2005 12:20pm at .
      #14
  5. myrddin is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/23/2005 11:40am


     Style: Hapkido, Caique BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I did Hapkido for about 3 1/2 years, now I am taking BJJ. I would not consider my Hapkido training to be something that would garner a ton of respect around these parts--no sparring, some aliveness but more of a focus on technical aspects of how moves should work.

    I personally consider that time and training to be very valuable, as you do a bit of a lot of things--striking, kicking, locking, a wee itty bit of ground. It definitely has given me a leg up in BJJ because I come into it already with some knowledge of effective locking technique, which has helped learning submissions.

    Another poster on this thread hit it right on though, most Hapkido places don't spar, and in most place you will be working with (for a long time at the start anyway) a compliant partner. So you do end up with a variety of techniques, probably about 1/2 of which you would feel comfortable with using in an actual altercation, and another 1/4 that you might use if a special circumstance warranted it. In any event you're not likely to use it much in sport, not because it is 73h d34d1y but just because most Hapkido instructors, even those who are excellent technicians, are traditionalist snobs who "aren't into sport applications".

    For example, GM Ji Han Jae. He created Sin Moo Hapkido. I did one of his seminars--a little pricey, so I only did those sessions I was interested in at the time. He's a little Korean guy who has some really weird thoughts about things like nutrition and sex and such as part of his martial arts philosophy. Stuff that IMO is definitely bullshido.

    On the other hand, the man is a master technician. I would never doubt his skill with applied locking in a fight. I don't know how much of his school's training is "alive" (the affiliated school that held the seminar was ridiculous-level mcdojo), but there is no "sport" competition element to his curriculum as far as I am aware, and also as far as I am aware no full-contact sparring. If anyone here is an affiliated Sin Moo member and can contradict this, let me know.

    So as with all things, your mileage may vary. One thing is for sure though, on this forum you're going to get a lot of MT, BJJ, Judo recommendations. Obviously nothing wrong with that, but as with everything you'll have to make up your own mind.

    One thing, if you are in Florida, make sure you stay away from Richard Hackworth, who I believe is still operating out of Florida somewhere. Major bullshido.
      #15
  6. Anthracis is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/23/2005 1:04pm


     Style: The Jits & Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It's Deja Vu all over again :angry4:

    I think that you have already made up your mind and are seeking justification to try it. If you really want to try Allen's Hapki YO' SOUL go ahead and give it a go. Then, go somewhere and train. I would recommend BJJ and/or Muay Thai. It has been my experience that BJJ is a lot more applicable on confrontations (except against multiple attackers) because you know that what you can effectively use against resisting opponents at the academy, you can use in an encounter...effectively. But it all depends on your goals. Are you in it for better health? Are you in it for competition? Are you in it for self defense? If you are only trying to better your health or are recovering from injuries and such, then you can do whatever you want. But if you want th3 d3adlin3ss, hapki YO' SOUL is not where you will find it.

    I hope that this contributes to your choice. I would take everyone's comments and go with what's in your heart. We're just trying to help you not waste your time, energy, and money! take it however you wish.
      #16
  7. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/23/2005 4:39pm

    staff
     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by torrefaction
    I actually did read this whole thread, and that's the reason I'm posting. After 38 pages of random people saying different things, I wasn't sure what the verdict is. From what I gathered, Deluxe never actually went to the school. So did someone find out for sure that this is more of an Aikido focused school than Hapkido?
    I tried to be pretty thorough. I read all the threads he (Jeff Allen) posted on here, and some on Budoseek (Where he seemed to have a certain amount of respect, and . From what I saw, when people called to check his references, what they got out of it was that he was well respected, and a skilled instructor. But I did notice a lot of what seemed like double-talk to me. I really am not trying to stir up the pot here, I wanted someone's honest opinion of hapkido, and then to see if anyone had actually been to that school. I'm just really wanting to take training seriously at this point in my life, and I don't want to end up at a less than top notch school.
    Wasn't actually talking to you about reading the other thread. You already told us you did and didn't want to attatch your question to a super long tedious thread (my words).

    As far as you other guys, the one thing I really hate about threads like this is all the BJJ and Muay Thai nutriders that come on here. I love this **** but can you come up with a bit more educated and enlightened answer. How about some school that does full contact and live grappling, then you open it up to more than just "take Muay Thai and BJJ" such a narrow view doesn't cut it for every question.
      #17
  8. CanucKyokushin is offline

    He'll flip ya!

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    Posted On:
    6/23/2005 5:01pm

    supporting member
     Style: Not.....working

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There is a Kyokushin school in Fort-Lauderdale.It's run by a big guy like you so you should feel as though you belong.His name Dennis Cheek .He's a second Dan and if he does Kyokushin Karate,then you are gonna get your money's worth.Go look for his school.You won't regret-it.
      #18
  9. torrefaction is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/23/2005 8:08pm


     Style: Uncertain

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Canuckyokushin
    There is a Kyokushin school in Fort-Lauderdale.It's run by a big guy like you so you should feel as though you belong.His name Dennis Cheek .He's a second Dan and if he does Kyokushin Karate,then you are gonna get your money's worth.Go look for his school.You won't regret-it.
    Now, a post like this is why I posted here. Up until now, I've never heard of Kyokushin. I've started to read about it, and I'm thoroughly intrigued. This seems like an excellent style, and the core philosophies behind it are something I can really latch on to and appreciate. I plan to at least take 1 or 2 trial classes, to see if it's for me. Hopefully the instructor will allow that. Thank you very much!

    I've also decided to attend a couple of Jeff Allen's classes. I've spoken to him on quite a few occasions, and he seems like a very nice man. I just have concerns about the claims he made, which appear to have been unfounded (which he admitted later on...that's the reason I've decided to give him the benefit of the doubt).

    I should state to the others that posted in here that I haven't ignored your advice. I went and took a Muay Thai class at American Top Team tonight. I got a chance to work with Christian "King Cobra" Toleque. Regardless of what I decide to do, Muay Thai is definitely an effective style, and I'd bet money that Christian is one of the best instructor's in the world. He was very excellent.
      #19
  10. CanucKyokushin is offline

    He'll flip ya!

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    Posted On:
    6/23/2005 8:17pm

    supporting member
     Style: Not.....working

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by torrefaction
    Now, a post like this is why I posted here. Up until now, I've never heard of Kyokushin. I've started to read about it, and I'm thoroughly intrigued. This seems like an excellent style, and the core philosophies behind it are something I can really latch on to and appreciate. I plan to at least take 1 or 2 trial classes, to see if it's for me. Hopefully the instructor will allow that. Thank you very much!

    .
    Excellent!More meat for the grinder.

    Kyokushin or Muay isn;t that far different really.Kyokushin has katas while Muay has a few spriritual and traditional aspects aswell.Not to mention Muay has a lot of Shemales.But I heard you get used to having them around you in the gym.

    Good luck!And If you chose Kyokushin I'll probably be seeing you around.
      #20
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