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  1. Omar is offline

    Baji demigod.

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    Posted On:
    6/11/2005 10:33pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Chinese Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Very funny.

    It's always impressive what kind of wierdness you can create by quoting things out of context. You conveniently left out the initial riducule of the question and thing like the first answer poseted to the question, "has there ever been a kung fu guy in the no hole barred circles?"

    Short answer: No.

    Estimated time to BTDT (Been There, Done That): 5 hours.

    Edit --
    Long answer: Yes, many, but to my knowledge not a one has ever become a (Shamrock, Gracie) 'guy to beat'.


    No excuses. Not even an apology. Just a simple statement of fact that there ARE IMA MMA competitors but so far no one in "the big leagues".


    Quote Originally Posted by JegerMeister
    http://www.emptyflower.com/cgi-bin/y...70702;start=30

    " Let's not forget that RULES play a big part as well. Combat and competition are very different. It's different fighting for winning a contest and fighting for your life. CMA guys get "stupified" when they are cut off from their main tactics by the rules and try to fight the other guy's game. I think in the street things might be drastically different. At least with XY guys, Baji guys, and others."
    Wow. A 200 post noob spouts nonsense. Let's look at the emptyflower response:

    Hmm, as a Baji-guy, I don't really see the street as that different from the ring re: available tools. Broken bottles and throwing sand in my opponent's face aren't really part of the system. Sure, the attitude/environment is different in the street par course, but you should definately be able to use your tools in either the ring or the street with no real problems. Though I'd have to forget about those nice groin strikes I so like in my Baji arsenal .. and I'd sure as heck would like to fight bare-fisted, but can't have everything.


    " I agree with kingmonkey,no matter how hard you try to create a real fight(lack of rules)in a ring.You can never capture the need to survive that comes with a real street fight.But hey,the UFC fights are fun to watch."
    Wow. 23 posts. Real representative of the views over there. . .

    " 3.MMA is a sport. IMO a very exciting and challenging sport. IMA does cross over to that sport. Golf is a sport. IMA crosses over. I have been a soldier and a law enforcement officer. Real Combat is about weapons employment, weapon retention, positioning, and movement. IMA crosses over into that as well. To train for any sport or activity, you need to practice the strategies that will produce victory----duh!
    And you point is? What was supposed to be funny about this? A LEO says that to him "real" fighting involves weapons. . . maybe you missed the part where he mentions being a soldier and a LEO.


    4.Labels and brand names dont fight. Most fighters are non IMA, but if you have any decent training at all, you should have an eye for attributes that they may naturally have that internal training tries to produce in a student
    That is very true. Something we often remind people of here on Bullshido.

    Are the points that I am trying to make coming through?"
    No. They're not.

    But my favorite of your is the last set of quotes:

    " I never trained specifically for MMA. The scope of the regular training already prepares someone to be comfortable with that level of pressure.

    The main thing is mindset, and the unique method of training which cultivates that mindset.

    There is no, "I train to win", in my tjq.

    There is no, "I am the subject of the training"

    There is no drilling of techniques - I don't believe in em.

    There is no 'groundfighting', 'stand-up', 'takedowns', 'throws', etc. From commencement to closure, the physical interaction is just practice and observation of transition/change from a neutral perspective.

    That all sounds real pretty and everything, but it aint.

    Aside from the solo drills I've posted here, there's really nothing more to it. The same movement that is trained in those drills is applied to the 'sparring' and exploration of tjq's ideas. MMA and sub-wrestling comps are just one avenue of that exploration. "
    You apparentlyu didn't realize that the person who posted those comments there has fought in maybe 8 or 10 MMA matches. He speaks from experience and HAS gotten in the ring to test his ideas. Try ridiculing people who have never fought next time. It's funnier.
    Fighting evil and upholding justice in blue silk pajamas baby!
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=UGaYD_wcaIg

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=6Uepo9ahg-M

    Bah!!! Puny Humans.


  2. liokault is offline

    Moron

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    Posted On:
    6/12/2005 6:51am


     Style: Tai Chi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal

    The IMA people say their art is not for competition. But I think its because they don't want to look foolish and beaten by people who take martial arts training seriously. They can't compete. Thats the key issue here. They have neither the mind set nor the conditioining.The fact is that competition breeds excellence and martial artists who train in competitive arts are always willing to put to the test what they preech. They don't try to hide behind excuses.
    Bit sweeping here guy.

    I can think of lots of IMA guys who get into the ring, and one who not only got into a cage with but beat the top ranked MMA guy in his weight class (in the UK, think he was an olympic medalist as well).





    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal
    Now as for this business about eye strikes ? Ah man, its not the trump card people believe it is. First of all eye strikes/groin kicks are a two way street. BOTH fighters can use them. Secondly if you think you can outclass a conditioned fighter simply because you know a couple of these 'cute' tricks then your fooling yourself.

    LOL I can see why you would be down on eye shots what with them being in the head, and knowing the stigma that Kyokushin guys have about hitting the head and every thing.



    I cant see the problem with people thinking that the ring and the street are differant things! B.J Penn rules in the ring but still failed to knock out a cop that he sucker punched said cop then tackles him, dispite B.J being with a crowd and a master of ground fighting!
    If this happend in the ring how long would the cop have lasted?
  3. Olorin is offline
    Olorin's Avatar

    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    6/13/2005 12:47am

    supporting memberhall of fame
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal
    Of coarse it obvious !!! That’s the point ! Sometimes people need the obvious pointed out to them. I still cannot believe with the amount of information there is in the martial arts world today how people cannot see the benefits of sparring and competition. Why they choose to 'bypass' all of that and hide behind the eye striking excuse is beyond me.
    Get em Hannibal! Sometimes we have to make a point over, and over, and over again. Tournament style martial artists can prove that they can do the things they say they can do. Their skill is subject to practical tests against opponents who are doing all they can to win. Some martial arts are based on nothing more than the “hope” that their tactics will work, while some are based on a record of accomplishment. Whenever I hear “to deadly” I think “too fat, to old, and to scared to prove it!”

    At my last judo tournament (I lost all three matches, and yes I suck) we had Judoka, Wrestlers, and Jiu Jitsu guys. Those who won, proved that they were the best under a set of rules, designed to allow for competition. I would rather study a MA with a track record than a MA that is based on nothing but faith…
  4. feedback is offline
    feedback's Avatar

    UAAAH!

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    Posted On:
    6/13/2005 1:04am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I LIKE TMA, you see what you fucking crazies have driven me to?

    Why is it so fucking hard to understand that fights IRL are 99% of the time ended by punching somebody in the fucking face? I'm fucking sick of idiots who have never been in a real fight try and tell people what "real fighting" entails. Real fights are not dominated by your queer oil-checking, fish hooking, eye poking, lumbar-tickling techniques.

    Your style is **** and you're a weak minded idiot because of the way you train and act.
    Tough is not how you act, tough is how you train.
  5. Hannibal is offline

    Grandmaster Sensei of Village Idiocy

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    Posted On:
    6/13/2005 1:10am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kyokushin and Judo.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Lio.

    Time out man. Sell that bullshit to someone else.

    Let me point out something.

    1. In Kyokushin you can kick to the head, knee to the head,kick to the body and legs. BUT since its bare knuckle fighting (the fighters wear no gloves) you can only punch to the body. The safety reasons for that are obvious.

    2. Kyokushin and other full contact styles certainly have a better track record of producing quality fighters than Tai Chi.

    3. I am not saying all Tai Chi and internal martial artists are usless. I'm sure there are a few around who can fight. In fact I would love to no more about the person you mentioned who knocked out a UFC champ. There are some amazing IMA guys around but they are not common and often hard to find.

    I don't have a problem with them. I have a problem with those who put down tournaments and sparring. Claiming they are of no use. That's a foolish attitude to take and a dangerous one that can give people false hope.
    Hannibal: The sworn enemy of dishonest politicians, source of entertainment on Bullshido and newly appointed Office Linebacker. Terry Tait ain't got **** on me !!!!
  6. Poofist is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    6/13/2005 1:11am


     Style: Escrima

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    So...you train absolutely no groundfighting, grappling, throwing, or takedowns?

    At all?

    Well good luck with that, pal. You've got balls.
  7. MrMcFu is offline

    Badness will not be rewarded

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    Posted On:
    6/13/2005 1:40am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Real life survival, non sporting, vicious, hardcore, the street . . .

    How the hell do you train? Beat up drunks at the bar?

    Oh wait, push hands and some forms will solve that problem . . .

    Push hands lying down = grappling right? It's the the principles that carry over and can be used in any situation, right?
  8. liokault is offline

    Moron

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    Posted On:
    6/13/2005 10:32am


     Style: Tai Chi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal
    Lio.

    Time out man. Sell that bullshit to someone else.

    Let me point out something.

    1. In Kyokushin you can kick to the head, knee to the head,kick to the body and legs. BUT since its bare knuckle fighting (the fighters wear no gloves) you can only punch to the body. The safety reasons for that are obvious..
    So wear gloves!!! its not like you guys are doing lots of grappling that gloves will stop is it? Why remove the most common senario?


    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal
    2. Kyokushin and other full contact styles certainly have a better track record of producing quality fighters than Tai Chi.
    No argument here, but 99% of tai chi really isnt tai chi, sad but true, anyway thats another (probably btdt) thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal
    3. I am not saying all Tai Chi and internal martial artists are usless. I'm sure there are a few around who can fight. In fact I would love to no more about the person you mentioned who knocked out a UFC champ. There are some amazing IMA guys around but they are not common and often hard to find. .
    This guy, Tai Chi

    Beat: MMA guy

    (just read, whilst finding links, that he has been against the same guy again and lost :cwm10: )

    And I didnt say he knocked him out, I said "beat". The fight was "won" after Berik cut Abduls eye with a elbow.

    Nor did I say he beat a UFC champ. I said highest rated MMA guy in his weight class, in the UK.

    I think it was a fight at cage rage 9.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal
    I don't have a problem with them. I have a problem with those who put down tournaments and sparring. Claiming they are of no use. That's a foolish attitude to take and a dangerous one that can give people false hope.
    Indeed, but no more dangerouse than thinking that cos you can win in the ring your invinciable....like the B.J thing I quoted.
  9. Omar is offline

    Baji demigod.

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    Posted On:
    6/13/2005 6:40pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Chinese Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Technically they're both MMA fighters.
    Fighting evil and upholding justice in blue silk pajamas baby!
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=UGaYD_wcaIg

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=6Uepo9ahg-M

    Bah!!! Puny Humans.


  10. SPJ is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    6/13/2005 9:38pm


     Style: Tai Ji

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There are many karate, TKD and BJJ schools.

    There are many Tai Chi schools for health and fitness.

    If there are many Shenwu like schools, then we may be able to see many IMA fighters in the ring?

    Karate, TKD are in the shopping area in just about any corner in any city in the states.

    Let us pick up a yellow page phone book and check that how many crotty and TKD schools compared with IMA schools in any town USA or canada.

    Karate and TKD have belt systems, regionals, world and even Olympic comp.

    Just a thought.

    :qleapfrog
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