Excellent article on MMA and tactical SD

[Senshi]

I know Jeremy and have trained with him quite a bit in the past. He's a really nice guy and a very good martial artist. He's actually producing a DVD Magazine which should be out in a few weeks and sounds brilliant. Here's what he wrote about it:

"Masters of Grappling DVD Series Volume one is a crazy five hour instructional documentary featuring Rigan Machado, Frank Shamrock, John Will, King of the Cage Fighter John "the Rev" Jensen, Paulo Guimaraes, wrestling phenom Talgat Ilyasov, Close quarter combat instructor Glenn Zwiers, BJJ brown Belt champ Rodrigo Viera and load of techniques from Murray Ballenden, Andrew Gorton, Cameron Rowe, Joss Richardson, Phillipa Katon and David Obrien.
Seriously guys this DVD is f*#king huge, two double layer DVD-9 Discs, over 300 minutes long. It's basically a magazine that you "watch" instead of read. It's not a hollywood production, but it still kicks arse! .....
Volume two also features Frank Shamrock, Rigan Machado, John Will as well as Larry Papadopoulos, former wrestling world champ Toshio Asakura, Elvis Sinosic, Igor, George Soturos (Sotiropolos) and many others."
I'll let you guys know when it comes out and do a review.

Apart from the :knob: Glenn Zwiers :knob: character it looks like it will be a nice little DVD!


:blob8:

[bushi51]

Well, I liked the article and disagree that you can not teach tactics. It is rather simply just ingraining a certain ruleset. Speaking as a LEO, tactics when it comes to H2H is very important and to say they do not work or cannot be taught is based on ignorance. Do not confuse tactics with techniques. Even situational techniques. I will give a for instance. The stance.

Instead of teaching a bastardized Muay Thai stance (aware of the takedown) why not use the LE Field Interview stance or something similar. A stance that puts you into a defensive posture while not looking confrontational, thus forcing a physical altercation. Now if **** kicks off, then you can easily go to the above mentioned fighting stance rather easily.

Another example may be to not train to hit the skull with a closed fist (for SD situations), instead use palm strikes and save the closed fist for more meaty portions of their anatomy. I personally know two other cops (who are great fighters, by the way) that have shattered their hands (gun hand mind you) closed fist striking an attacking suspect. It happens to boxers all the time.

Believe it or not these are tactics.

[MrMcFu]

Duh everyone.

Restraining someone and trying to kick their ass are two different things. So is bouncing at a bar and being in a "streetfight".

[Ronin]

In my bouncing days I have used everything I could, including the bathroom sink.

By far the LEAST damaging were chokes.

I don't recall ever arm barring anyone...or leg locking anyone.

[TylerDurden]

I am not seeing the downside in the article to MMA style training. He used his MMA skills to subdue and control the bad guy. He had the option to do damage if he needed to, decided it was not required and simply controlled the situation. So where in this was MMA training not a good thing? If his point was be careful what techniques you use, then it's a valid one. If his point was MMA training is somehow bad for self defense then his own story invalidates that.

[antman]

The solution is that there is no solution.

I agree with Strong Machine that common sense and awareness of what you need at the time determines how to defend. Having the ability to be in control of your self in the situation as opposed to insticntively acting is key.

[TylerDurden]

MMA is a set of tools. It's easy to teach someone how to use the tools, teaching them when is nearly impossible.

[Feryk]

I am not seeing the downside in the article to MMA style training. He used his MMA skills to subdue and control the bad guy. He had the option to do damage if he needed to, decided it was not required and simply controlled the situation. So where in this was MMA training not a good thing? If his point was be careful what techniques you use, then it's a valid one. If his point was MMA training is somehow bad for self defense then his own story invalidates that.

I think his point was that you fight like you train. If you train to go to the ground right away, and look for subs, it's probably not the right thing. Most of his points were, I believe, common sense. He is trying to use a real example from his work to demonstrate the point that an armbar (which would be a great move in an MMA match) was not the right move in this situation.

If nothing else, his point that he needed to look beyond the current confrontation was a good one. IRL, each confrontation has consequences afterwards. So, breaking the guys arm, even though he could have, wouldn't be the wisest thing.

[MrMcFu]

Delivery system is the same, the application is different. Any questions?

[Strong Machine]

Sure he was saying MMA training is a good thing just not everything.And he is undeniably correct.I just disagree with a couple of his examples.
Yes, there are situations where submission holds are not a smart move.No question.But the same can be said for every move.There are situations where punches or holddowns have no value as well.I just wonder why everyone always seems to create articles explaining in carefully worded diatribes why subs are not always the best.
No one has ever come in my school and asked me to teach them to get really good at not hurting people.Not once.I teach cops, prison guards, bouncers etc.
They all want to know how to hurt people in case they need it to save themselves.
As far as the legal questions go.I leave that to the D.A. and if need be a jury of my peers.
Worrying how a a jury may see what you did in your own self-defense is a good way to get dead.I'd rather be in prison than in the ground.