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  1. HAPKO3 is offline
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    Marasmos

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    Posted On:
    4/29/2005 7:27pm

    supporting member
     Style: 10th Planet JJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by BaguaMonk
    ... The problem with TMA's is that most people won't really "hit" eachother, kick to the knees, balls, even nose is something that can leave some serious damage...
    The problem with you is that you know nothing about fighitng and yet pollute the forum with your misinformed "opinions."

    You should kill yourself.
    You say what about my rice?
  2. I aint punchy!? is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/29/2005 9:18pm


     Style: Arnis, WC, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by BaguaMonk
    TMA's will ever relive their glory since there is no such thing as "life-or-death" fighting nowdays, nor is it necessary.
    I agree with the fact that they're not delivering full blows... and this is hard to do in a real situation. Even supposed no-rules-fighting events have plenty of rules that limit what can be done.

    But...

    TMAs can have realistic fighting training (aka sparring) that does teach real fighting in a real situation. Some things will have to be ruled out to some degree (no one likes a finger in the eye, or a boot to the groin). The most important thing to teach in figthing styles of any kind is spontaneity of movement in response to the unscripted movements of an opponent. The opponent shouldn't always be restricted to certain movements: being loose and floppy, or hard, delivering one strike then stopping, not moving in or crowding, from grappling or grabbing. If your style does require lots of restrictions then try and change them often so that different aspects get fighting experience, and experiment with protective gear.

    The main proviso should be not to cause injury to your training partner, pain is fine but injury is out. This takes control and judgement from both those people sparring to acknowledge things that would work in an honest way. The up-side of this is that by developing your skill in understanding what would have happened when someone pulls a strike/technique, it teaches you how open you are, what a counter might be, and what some obscure techniques in your style might actually have been meant for.
  3. Lefty is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/30/2005 6:11am


     Style: FMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Earlier I guessed that maybe these guys have trained in JKD primarily and only know a bit about those two styles.


    Wounded Ronin got pissed off thinking coz one of the guys was doing a Bruce Lee imitation that I was saying that.

    But noone can really deny that someone is using a JKD fighting style bcoz it changes so much from person to person and school to school.

    Here is a quote and link from a JKD club instructor to back that up:

    "If someone tells me that they train the martial art of JKD I still don't
    have a good picture of their fighting style."

    http://www.rmata.com/styles.html
  4. EmetShamash is online now
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    Posted On:
    3/28/2006 5:06pm


     Style: Chinese Martial Arts

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I think that the guy in the white shirt was supposedly mantis. He doesn't look like he is using anything distinctively kung fu, but the guy in the blue pants is obviously minding his center line... poorly and with no aggresion or speed. Both suck. Screw this ****.
  5. Tenebrous is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    3/28/2006 5:16pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by EmetShamash
    I think that the guy in the white shirt was supposedly mantis. He doesn't look like he is using anything distinctively kung fu, but the guy in the blue pants is obviously minding his center line... poorly and with no aggresion or speed. Both suck. Screw this ****.
  6. Asriel is offline
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    I'd like to leave this world like I came into it: Screaming, naked & covered in someone else's blood

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    Essex
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    Posted On:
    3/29/2006 3:17am

    supporting member
     Style: Muay Thai (BJJ hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lefty
    Yeah I agree but the guy in the white shirt rarely guards his center in a structured way like I'd expect to see in WC. He looks kind of like freestyle karate - with the lead arm low and the back arm often coming up to cover the side of the head.

    Also he isnt using WC footwork. He is doing high kicks and has a wide side stance. In WC these arent used and he would be considered wide open. So although he may mind his centerline a bit he isnt really an appropriate representative of WC - although he is likely the WC fighter of the two.

    The guy in the black shirt has much the same stance and fighting repetoire as his opponent. However his lead arm is left almost completely straight out most of the time. That isnt advisable in WC because the arm can be grabbed, trapped and pinned etc. it also reduces response speed and power. However, It also doesnt seem like Northern Mantis.

    Northern Mantis fighters generally assume the posture of a mantis with both wrists bent, like in this picture: Northern Mantis

    Neither of the two MAers assume this quite distinguishing stance...

    I'm guessing that both MAers come from the same school where they got shown some concepts from both arts and decided to try and spar like that but werent really able to represent the two different styles and fell back on what they know.

    Maybe some kind of JKD or freestyle karate school perhaps?
    Praying Mantis practitioners don't actually fight in that stance. The imitating of the Mantis with the bending of the wrists and closing of the hands is for form training only. When that particular move is performed it is a catch and grab/pull called Mantis catches the Cicada and involves catching at the wrist and elbow.
  7. EmetShamash is online now
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    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    3/30/2006 2:03am


     Style: Chinese Martial Arts

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Tenebrous
    Yes, excellent!!! We will use them as bullet sheilds in the great Bullshido culling of the guilty. Their sacrifice will undoubtedly save our asses. The Blue Lotus will keep us in drone mercenaries for the first wave...

    "Larp... ribbet... larp..."
  8. Tenebrous is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    3/30/2006 3:13pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by EmetShamash
    Yes, excellent!!! We will use them as bullet sheilds in the great Bullshido culling of the guilty. Their sacrifice will undoubtedly save our asses. The Blue Lotus will keep us in drone mercenaries for the first wave...

    "Larp... ribbet... larp..."
    I seriously didn't understand a word of that.
  9. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/06/2006 12:12am

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My first Thread ressurection Yeah.

    Well we argued (me and lefty) and disagreed what the clip represents.


    Well here is the supposed explanation:

    http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/foru...499#post673499

    Hello,

    To all seven star praying mantis (TangLang) family. This message is concerning the short video clip called (Mantis108) A.K.A Mantis "vs" Wing Chun. I was not aware of this information until I was searching the online internet on mantis. How this all happened, I was talking to a close friend of mine and his name is Sifu Nikita Young Johnson. His styles are Wing Chun/JKD/Praying Mantis. I told him that I meet a Wing Chun Sifu by the name of Milan Kecic, disciple of Grand Master William Cheung. Sifu Milan in my opinion, I would rate him as a top Kungfu fighter. If you don't know what you are doing when you are fighting him. You will get hurt. His master did a good job teaching him. Sifu Milan wanted to start his own Wing Chun classes at my temple (School). I told this to Sifu Nikita, he was very excited to meet Sifu Milan. Sifu Nikita, asked me if he could bring in his video camera. I told him Sifu Milan and I was training together in private. I'm helping him on his endurance and conditioning of his body. I told Sifu Milan with this type of training it would be hard for anyone to beat him. That's how I train my students. Sifu Milan asked me one day while we were training. Why do you play a defense all the time when we are sparring? I told him that a good defense fighter could attack at anytime. I also told him that in the past I would spar with top Martial Art Fighters. The fighters would leave the school feeling ok. The next day I would receive a call from the fighters stating that they woke up the next morning with injuries. Some needed to seek medical attention for these injuries which made me feel real bad. So my point is to Sifu Milan, if I do not feel that you are not on my level, I would not attack you. If I do it will be with extra control. That is why I am always concern of my opponent. I also stated to Sifu Milan that if you want me to attack, you must spar first with one of my disciples. Sifu Frank Gonzalez, a first degree black sash. Sifu Milan said ok, so we setup the match. The sparring match lasted 30 seconds. Sifu Milan bowed out stating that he has no medical insurance. Later on that day while leaving out of the temple (School), Sifu Milan called me "MASTER". I told him he does not have to call me master, I'm just a coach. Thinking back years ago I remember my first Kungfu master, Master Kwan telling me that my skills are too advance, that I should not spar people because they would get hurt. I also remember the first time I got hurt in training is when my last master. Master Raymond Ly, told me not to use my fighting skills in sparring one of his favorite disciples.

    Getting back to the video clip, that day of sparring with Sifu Milan I noticed the look on Sifu Milan's face. When he seen Sifu Nikita bringing in the video camera, he became different in his actions. I told Sifu Nikita that I think Sifu Milan feels uncomfortable about the video camera. I explained to Sifu Milan that the camera was for Sifu Nikita private training and that he like to video different sparring matches. So don't worry about anything, I gave Sifu Milan my word. Due to the camera being setup I felt that Sifu Milan was intimidated and was actually attacking me with edger moves while I was playing a defensive role. That's why in the video clip I was asking Sifu Milan are you ok. At the end of the video you notice that I told Sifu Milan that I was only working on conditioning. Due to the fact I did not want him to feel intimidated by me. I was shocked!!! When I observed the video clip on the world wide internet. I do not own or have a copy of the video clip. I got in touch with Sifu Nikita about the situation of the private video clip, he stated that he let his student borrow the tape for practice and was not aware of him using it on the internet world wide. So my point is the video clip you see was only a friendly sparring match between two friends which was not for public viewing. The video just got into the wrong hands with out my permission. Traditional Praying Mantis was not used in this clip!!! Someone just made there own little movie.

    I want to give special thanks to those out there who saw the video clip and knew what was actually going on. Also, I would like to stress in traditional TangLang or any other Martial Arts you can not use certain moves in sparring as your opponent will get hurt. For the person who put the video clip out there, I know this was done with good intentions. I've been teaching the Praying Mantis/TangLang system for over 20 years and my record speaks for it's self. I have no intentions to reply to future gossip. If you're ever in the city of Chicago you can visit me at my temple. For more information visit www.mantisfist.com.

    Thank You,

    Sifu Lee Lera,

    P.S. If one thing I learned from this is to never trust a so call friend to Video you, while play fighting with someone.
    Notice how the "Master" has no ego like us asshole bullshido members.
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