Easily Distracted by Food.
Posted On:3/01/2005 9:07am
I've heard of Team Ground Control. It's legit in terms of instruction. The pricing and all that...it's your choice.
Go for a trial lesson but check it out at least. Won't hurt.
Also, why don't you test your stand up skills at Team Ground Control? Try and 'spar' someone your level and see if the FJP holds up against what TGC teaches.
You're never going to know unless you try it.
Posted On:3/01/2005 9:16am
Sean Alvarez has placed 2nd in the ADCC's a bunch of times. And as others have said Guiterrez is a legit badass black belt under Renzo. TRAIN THERE NOW!
Is Wayne Brady gonna have to choke a bitch?
Posted On:3/01/2005 9:20am
Originally Posted by KuNg FooL
I guess if this place is as awesome as it seems then the only thing that would hold me back would be that I'm currently studying Fu-Jow Pai Kung Fu and I love it and it feels right to me and I'm really advancing in skill level so I don't know if I'd want to end a good thing like that. Wouldn't it be stupid of me to give that up when I'm doing well? I'd do both, but I couldn't afford that, so should I continue with the FJP until I reach a personal peak or have at least a decent rank, and then move on to Ground Control?
See what type of introductory offer they have. If they have a few before you have to sign a contract try it out. It might open your eyes. All the stuff you listed about your art I felt for mine. You added a little part that reminded me of my excuse for training and you said it twice. Advancong skill and Rank. I neglected trying a Gracie school because of these things. I realized I was a belt-rank whore. I wanted that next rank and passed up checking out a school.
Posted On:3/01/2005 9:25am
I'll just stop with the leading questions and say: Yes, do BJJ.
Hell, I suppose this thread is as good as any at writing up my experience last night.
When I came into class last night, four "punk" types were sitting near the door, as far away from the mat as possible. They were probably 17-20 years old, and decorated in goatees and lip rings and "alternative music bands" t-shirts.
Out of all of these tough-looking fellows, the only one will the balls to try the free class was the kung fu guy. We'll call him Zach.
He was gassing after a light warmup, but he was pleasantly eager to learn. I was paired up with him to do his first day lesson. It started with Eduardo having him lay on the mat in front of his friends, and having me mount him.
(Giggles from the audience.)
"Escape from there," said Eduardo.
And so he timidly starts shoving straight into me, and Eduardo tells him "Really go for it!" and he flails around wildly and starts doing the Standard Kung Fu Escape, where he tries to hook his feet in my armpits. I could have armbarred at any moment, punched him in the face, leaned over and kissed him, whatever. He wasn't going to escape, and I was just sitting there pushing his legs out of my armpits.
"I have no idea what I'm doing," he said. Correct answer.
So he is taught the upa escape, ending with him in my guard.
(Giggles from the audience.)
While we are drilling this, I find out from him that his friends chickened out and they all have fliers for a free class. He tells me that his friend Aaron keeps going on and on about BJJ and got them to come in (Thanks Bizarro Root!). He even heard the story of the JJJ black belt who got beat up by white belts, and I pointed out the black belt on the wall that this guy left. That was one of his friend's instructors, he said.
By now Eduardo had come over from the main class and taught him a basic guard pass. So we drilled this a while more, and I helped him understand base, posture, using his weight and stuff like that.
Eduardo wanted me in the main class for something, so I leave this kung fu fellow and drill some guard passes. He gets teamed up with Crazy James and I prayed for his life.
Near the end of class, he was getting ready to leave with his friends while we were still sparring. I think one of them made a snide comment, because Zach stops me as I walk by and tells his friend "Tell him what you just told me", and the guy backpedalled and told me something else. "Yo, I wanna be a stand-up fighting, a striker, like a boxer."
So I gave them an ultra condensed version of UFC 1-4. "If you watch the first UFCs, you'll see boxing versus wrestling versus kung fu versus karate versus this. And almost the first four years of it were all won by someone doing this stuff [pointing to class sparring]. It wasn't until people started learning this stuff that stand-up fighting really came back" [more on this below.]
I explained what "the guard" is and why we would have just spent 45 minutes learning to "pass" it. "If you're on the bottom, and you don't want to be punched in the face too badly, you use that position, because you can control the top man with your legs and arms. If you want to attack, you want to get around his legs, because you can't punch or choke or armlock him well from inside his guard."
And last of all, and which applies to you, KuNg FooL, I told them that if you want to be a stan-up fighter, you have even MORE reason to learn groundfighting, because as has been seen time and time again, even two experience strikers will end up clinching and falling to the ground and flailing around, but if they knew what to do on the ground, they would be able to control the situation and stand-up again.
I hope the kung fu guy comes back in, since he did really well (for a first night) and I hope his viado friends don't try to ruin it for him with completely retarded "durr da wuz ghay" comments because they had no idea what was going on. I heard him telling them "No, it's a lot more complicated than it looks. You really should just try it out." and I told them the same.
Anyway, back on topic...
GO TO THIS SCHOOL NOW.
Last edited by Aesopian; 3/01/2005 9:41am at .
Posted On:3/01/2005 9:28am
Style: jazz hands
I have been thinking of starting a thread in general BS about loyalty to your current school. I think it is relevant in this case, KuNg FooL seems to be having some issues about switching styles.
Should I make the thread?
ok the thread is over there.
Last edited by the Dabbler; 3/01/2005 9:36am at .
Posted On:3/01/2005 9:40am
I'm not a rank whore. I just meant I'll wait until the next one to see how I feel. I really don't care how many stripes are on my sash. I just wanna be good enough in my eyes. I was only using the ranking promotions as a time frame. Like, by the time I get this rank, we'll see how I feel about myself. It will have nothing to do with the rank, just with what I've learned so far and if I think I'm good enough in my opinion.
Aesopian - I agree with everything you're saying. I know the importance of experience and training for the ground, I have already make clear that I definitely want to go to this school, or at least learn BJJ. I'm just saying that the question of when is bothering me because I don't want to just assume that my stand up is good enough and then get really good on the ground. A well rounded fighter is great standing up and on the ground. I wouldn't consider my stand up to be "great" yet so I don't know if I want to stop.
Posted On:3/01/2005 9:44am
A "well rounded fighter" is one who can fight standing and on the ground. Don't worry about the "great" part yet. You'll never be "great", much less "well rounded", if you don't just go learn ground fighting in the first place.
Posted On:3/01/2005 10:24am
So you're saying you can't be great with only stand up fighting, but you can be great with only ground fighting? No offense, but it seems like you're all for ground fighting and you think stand up fighting is a waste of time. I wanna be good at both. I mean I would love to start the BJJ training right now, but I don't wanna pretend that my stand up is good enough and I don't need to be any better with it. There are a lot of things I need to get better at with my stand up game and if I switch to the BJJ now, I'll never get better standing up. Then lets say I stick with BJJ for years. I'd be a great ground fighter, and an average stand up fighter. Wouldn't it be better to be great at both? Or are you saying that being great on the ground means you don't have to be great standing up?
Posted On:3/01/2005 10:28am
If you look at the past of MMA fighting that statement does bear out. Grapplers with bad stand up fair better than strikers with bad grappling. Look at the fortunes of Leko in recent Prides. A great K1 kickboxer who has gotten owned in the MMA ring do to his lack of grappling. While somewhat one dimensional wrestler Mark Coleman had won titles in Pride in the past.
Now some strikes have made very good transitions like Cro Cop and Lidell. But both of them have worked incredibly hard to get up to speed on their grappling. Basically it's easier to take someone down than to knock them out.
Posted On:3/01/2005 10:38am
With regards to you personally, I am saying you are never going to be a WELL ROUNDED fighter and GREAT at both STAND UP and GROUND FIGHTING if all you ever do is STAND UP and NO GROUND FIGHTING.
I am also saying that if you REALLY want to be a stand up fighter, it is VERY important that you learn what to do on the ground SO YOU CAN KEEP IT STANDING.
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