Therien McDojo

**reality hurts** · Posted On: 3/10/2005 7:44am

The one in the far west end is far better than the rest, and the one in Manotick... I'd have to say for Therien Schools. For BJJ/ Vale Tudo, OAMA is good... Just my humble opinion.

**TheStanMan** · Posted On: 3/10/2005 8:08am

Originally Posted by jamboo

When I tried putting my hips into my punches rather than just the arm, the sensei told me not to use my body, just my arm.

:angry7: :BangHead:

What a complete asswit.

**marcdscott** · Posted On: 3/10/2005 12:25pm

There are a lot of great schools in Ottawa without resorting to Can-Ryu (shudder) JuJitsu.

There is Igor Yakimov's school in the west end near Tunney's Pasture: http://www.rus-sambo.com if you want Sambo/Judo/MMA

There is OAMA school which is run by a Renzo Gracie Affliate for BJJ/MMA

There is Ronin MMA for BJJ/MMA/MT

Marc

**bamboo** · Posted On: 3/10/2005 12:51pm

As well....

KYOKUSHIN OTTAWA GOUDREAULT
Chief Instructor: Laurier Goudreault (sandan)
Phone: 613-798-5273

Bob Carver's Martial Arts Academy (muay-thai and shooto)
Phone: 613-233-6981

De-ai aikiaki
Chief instructor Colin West (yondan)
phone:797-0122

Plus a whole lot of REALLY shitty mcdojos

cheers,
bamboo

**Ronin** · Posted On: 3/10/2005 12:59pm

Originally Posted by bamboo

As well....

KYOKUSHIN OTTAWA GOUDREAULT
Chief Instructor: Laurier Goudreault (sandan)
Phone: 613-798-5273

Bob Carver's Martial Arts Academy (muay-thai and shooto)
Phone: 613-233-6981

De-ai aikiaki
Chief instructor Colin West (yondan)
phone:797-0122

Plus a whole lot of REALLY shitty mcdojos

cheers,
bamboo

Gourdreault is a good man.

**Snapp** · Posted On: 3/10/2005 2:23pm

While your experience sounds completely horrible, I would not right off Can-Ryu Jiu Jitsu altogether.

I take Can-Ryu Jiu Jitsu here in BC and while I do wish the people in my class where more "hardcore". I have a lot of fun and have definatly not had the bad experiences you had.

Where I take Can-Ryu, Classes are $50 a month for two 1.5 hour classes per week. We do not punch from the horse stance or even do anything from the horse stance... Sometimes you take horse stance to keep balance, but definatly not to punch. The punching techniques that we practice are strictly Western Boxing Style and I was surprised to find out in my first class that what we were doing was identical to the Vitor Belfort Boxing Techniques instructional, I had just watched a couple days before.

We dont really do much ground work, a few sweeps and some basic wrist, arm, shoulder locks and my Sensei will be first to tell you that we probably do not do as much ground work as we should. He says that is because this is a "law enforcement" friendly system you cant screw around on the ground with a full equipment belt and holster.

We practice Hip throws, and many other takedowns. I dont see anything wrong with that, take downs are cool (and useful), and hip throws are fun!

Testing is done when Sensei decides you are ready, and I have seen people fail the test due to lack of knowledge, hell Ive seen the same guy fail the same test twice.

We do sparring (I am an orange belt), altho I wish we did more, like every class instead of once a week. There is even a Traditional Jiu Jitsu tournament in the works later this year.

My instructor has never tried to sell me anything, there is no Donuts in our dojo. I break a sweat every class, and even puked during one of them (too much dinner + overexertion).

Sorry if I went off on a bit of a rant here, but your experience with the McDojo really pisses me off because its giving the style I am currently taking a bad name...

That all being said, I too may switch to Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. For 2 reasons, 1. Id like to do more sparring, a lot more... and 2. I could probably convince a friend to grapple with me, but I doubt they would do full contact sparring, which would be requried to practice Can-Ryu.

Edit: Just looked at the Therien website... If that doesnt SCREAM MCDojo I dont know what does.

http://www.jiu-jitsu.com/

**jamboo** · Posted On: 3/26/2005 1:11am

Originally Posted by reality hurts

This is a reply to Jamboo. Dude I feel bad for how you feel about the school, but just keep in mind that there is only two good therien schools in Ottawa. It doesn't sound like you were at those schools. Therien is a good school for self defence martial arts, and there is alot of BS involved in some of their teachings. Their market is not males in the age 18-30 who want to learn how to fight. There is alot of people there that do it as a sport to keep fit Mainly 30-50 and out of shape that complain alot in general. Their other market is kids, and they appeal mainly to parents because it teaches their kids some discipline.

In Martial arts repetition makes you good.

If you want to try a real good MMA/BJJ school in Ottawa, try www.OAMA.ca you will not regret it. If you come back after a week I will be surprised. Lots of guys who get their egos bruised don't come back... It's hard work, instructors are good and you get out of it what you put in. Hard work = good results... And on top of that they have the best of the best come and do seminars. One of them was Renzo Gracie. Need I say more...

I went to the main school downtown (Parkdale) and the one in Stittsville. Therien will NOT teach males 18-30 to fight. The only thing it taught me was to be a lot more skeptical of martial arts schools.

do you train at renzo gracie's school?

I'm either going to join the renzo gracie school, (www.oama.ca), Ronin MMA (www.ronin-mma.com) or Igor Yakimov's sambo (www.rus-sambo.com), but I don't know which one would give me more for my buck. Right now I have no striking training, so I want a school with boxing or MT.

**OneInchPunch** · Posted On: 3/26/2005 7:37am

I'm either going to join the renzo gracie school, (www.oama.ca), Ronin MMA (www.ronin-mma.com) or Igor Yakimov's sambo (www.rus-sambo.com), but I don't know which one would give me more for my buck. Right now I have no striking training, so I want a school with boxing or MT.

I'm in Ottawa, and you won't go wrong with any of those 3 schools mentioned.

Check them all out and decide from there. Ignore anyone who says otherwise.

**Edge** · Posted On: 3/26/2005 11:23am

The Therien-Saint John Connection:

**TuchNRoll** · Posted On: 10/08/2006 12:12am

Originally Posted by Snapp

While your experience sounds completely horrible, I would not right off Can-Ryu Jiu Jitsu altogether.

I take Can-Ryu Jiu Jitsu here in BC and while I do wish the people in my class where more "hardcore". I have a lot of fun and have definatly not had the bad experiences you had.

Where I take Can-Ryu, Classes are $50 a month for two 1.5 hour classes per week. We do not punch from the horse stance or even do anything from the horse stance... Sometimes you take horse stance to keep balance, but definatly not to punch. The punching techniques that we practice are strictly Western Boxing Style and I was surprised to find out in my first class that what we were doing was identical to the Vitor Belfort Boxing Techniques instructional, I had just watched a couple days before.

We dont really do much ground work, a few sweeps and some basic wrist, arm, shoulder locks and my Sensei will be first to tell you that we probably do not do as much ground work as we should. He says that is because this is a "law enforcement" friendly system you cant screw around on the ground with a full equipment belt and holster.

We practice Hip throws, and many other takedowns. I dont see anything wrong with that, take downs are cool (and useful), and hip throws are fun!

Testing is done when Sensei decides you are ready, and I have seen people fail the test due to lack of knowledge, hell Ive seen the same guy fail the same test twice.

We do sparring (I am an orange belt), altho I wish we did more, like every class instead of once a week. There is even a Traditional Jiu Jitsu tournament in the works later this year.

My instructor has never tried to sell me anything, there is no Donuts in our dojo. I break a sweat every class, and even puked during one of them (too much dinner + overexertion).

Sorry if I went off on a bit of a rant here, but your experience with the McDojo really pisses me off because its giving the style I am currently taking a bad name...

That all being said, I too may switch to Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. For 2 reasons, 1. Id like to do more sparring, a lot more... and 2. I could probably convince a friend to grapple with me, but I doubt they would do full contact sparring, which would be requried to practice Can-Ryu.

Edit: Just looked at the Therien website... If that doesnt SCREAM MCDojo I dont know what does.

http://www.jiu-jitsu.com/

For the initiator of this thread:

If you really want to spar in Ottawa, just go to any downtown bar and shout "the SENS SUCK".

Seriously, if you want to learn to fight well, it takes time, at any real school in any discipline. TJJ stresses technique then speed then power. The color belt and stripe tests are for you to gauge your progress - if you skate through a test, it's you that's bullshido.
The black belt test is the "great equalizer". At TJJ you are expected to do the best you can, and then some.

Many quit TJJ early, often around the green belt level. The reasons are common: "too rough", "too repetitive", "too much work" and on rare occassion, "not enough sparring". Those who quit at a higher belt usually do because they find it too rough. The program is designed to increase in intensity as you advance through the belt levels. At around the brown belt level, it is expected that you have progressed enough to hit and be hit with more strength and focus. Safety is paramount - an injured student cannot train.

Most of those who quit because of the lack of sparring at a low belt level are not really interested in learning martial arts.

TJJ is a loose association of somewhat independent schools. There is a somewhat common curriculum, and board of senior instructors that give the black belt test. John Therien heads the board. (Jean-Yves is not on that board, he runs the kick boxing program). I'm not going to go through the pedigrees of everyone on the board - you can do your own research - try Google.

Because of the number of TJJ schools (not counting spin off schools, which are many), the consistency of instruction will vary. The school I went to for 4+ years had many good, many excellent and, yes, a few, passable instructors. Every board member an excellent sensei, and has incredible martial arts knowledge and experience to pass on, including sparring and competition.

At TJJ, like other schools I have trained at, if you want to spar and compete, you must show the ability and commitment - which usually means getting your black belt, or close to it, as well as training in addition to the normal classes.

I never had the problems with tuition that you state you had. Perhaps its the way you quit - but again, I can't speak to the particular school you went to.

Now, on to curriculum: CAN-Ryu Jiu-Jitsu was started by Georges Sylvain (http://206.191.61.136/budo/interviews/beauchamp_1.html). John Therien was his student before starting his own school which grew to a collection of schools. The CAN-Ryu system developed by TJJ appears to be slightly different from the BC CAN-Ryu system.

The TJJ black belt curricullum has lots of throwing, take downs, striking techniques, controlling technigues, hold escapes, grappling and ground defense, baton, and yawara stick. It's a broad based mixed martial arts system, and there's only so much that can be crammed into a given program. I would have liked to see more throwing and counters, other students I know like more grappling, others would like more striking and sparring, others would like more weapons instruction. You can't please everyone.

What I like about TJJ CAN-Ryu is that it is a flexible system, open to incorporating techniques that work from other martial arts. While the program is built upon repition of "basic techinques" for lower belts, this is primarly for training purposes. Ultimately, for black belts, the techniques that work best for you are the preferred techniques.

Ever curriculum technique has a rationale. We do practice "punching from a horse stance", and kicking from a horse stance. This is helps develop flexibility, and, most important, balance. It's not a technique to be used in sparring, competition, or self defense. [I once had a very interesting seminar from a kung fu "Sifu". He had us hopping backwards and forwards on one leg while kicking and punching with our eyes closed. Not a practical fighting technique, but an excellent training excercise for dynamic balance.]

Finally, web site: yes, TJJ is a business, and they do advertise. Personally, I prefer to train at a school that is financially solvent and can provide quality facilities. They have an excellent kids program, and they purposely target the general adult population. More students does increase revenue - there's only so many hard core 18-30 year olds interested in martial arts that haven't yet injure dthemselves and they usually don't have a lot of money to spend on tuition. Teaching kids and a wide range of adults makes for better sensei's and a more rounded school.

There's always room at TJJ for those who want to train harder, practice technique, spar, grapple, and compete.

:-)

And yes, I have a black belt in CAN-Ryu Jiu-Jitsu from Therien. I have no doubt that I worked bloody hard to get it.