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  1. v1o is offline

    Lightweight

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    189

    Posted On:
    2/24/2005 9:45am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: WSL Wing Chun

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    They showed this on the Discovery Channel as well as Kaliyiparati and the Indian wrestlers.
    They are some great fighitng arts hidden away in India.
  2. LLL is offline

    X

    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    2,869

    Posted On:
    2/24/2005 11:52am

    supporting member
     Style: None

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by kickcatcher
    Excellent post.

    There are (apparently) strong links between Pankration (introduced to India by Alexander The Great's conquest) and Varamushti -and later the Tibetan Martial Art of Lion's Roar (later Lama Pai/Hop Gar etc).

    The 'Alexander the Great's Pankration = Asian MAs' is an unproven myth, though... 'Western Martial Arts' supremacists like to say that, but there's zero proof...
  3. eyebeams is offline

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    1,437

    Posted On:
    2/24/2005 6:27pm


     Style: Kickboxing/Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    AFAIK, Vajramukti/Vajramushti means a whole bunch of things, from a premodern military training regimen to a form of sport wrestling. I'm sure that by muddying the context you can say it has all kinds of stuff.
  4. JohnnyS is offline

    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    1,139

    Posted On:
    2/24/2005 6:39pm

    supporting member
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    One thing my coach, John Will (author of the above article) said to me was that the only person he'd seen ever able to "really disarm" someone in a live situation was an Indian fellow. He said he saw people armed with clubs, knives and even swords, coming at this guy who was unarmed, and this guy was able to disarm his opponent. Of course he's seen other people do it in demonstrations, but never in an alive manner trying to hurt them, or with someone not their own student.
  5. eyebeams is offline

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    1,437

    Posted On:
    2/24/2005 6:42pm


     Style: Kickboxing/Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyS
    One thing my coach, John Will (author of the above article) said to me was that the only person he'd seen ever able to "really disarm" someone in a live situation was an Indian fellow. He said he saw people armed with clubs, knives and even swords, coming at this guy who was unarmed, and this guy was able to disarm his opponent. Of course he's seen other people do it in demonstrations, but never in an alive manner trying to hurt them, or with someone not their own student.
    I can't see it being too easy to find people who like you to come at you full force with a weapon, though.

    "Hey Jimmy, could you please try to stab me to death? We'll go for beers later."
  6. JohnnyS is offline

    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    1,139

    Posted On:
    2/24/2005 7:18pm

    supporting member
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My coach lived and trained in Indonesia for 8 years, as well as training in India a couple of times, Nepal, Japan, Thailand etc. He said of ALL the people he has seen, no-one was as good as this Indian guy.
  7. eyebeams is offline

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    1,437

    Posted On:
    2/24/2005 7:40pm


     Style: Kickboxing/Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyS
    My coach lived and trained in Indonesia for 8 years, as well as training in India a couple of times, Nepal, Japan, Thailand etc. He said of ALL the people he has seen, no-one was as good as this Indian guy.
    Oh sure. He may well be totally awesome. I'm just pointing out that it's rather difficult to try and get a dude who isn't a psychopath to try and beat you with a club or stab you to death.
  8. JohnnyS is offline

    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    1,139

    Posted On:
    2/24/2005 7:45pm

    supporting member
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I see your point, but it's probably not as much of an issue if you live in a slum in an impoverished nation compared to somewhere like the U.S. or Australia. Also, if you get a reputation, I'd imagine that there will be plenty of people happy to take it away from you.
  9. Freddy is offline

    Senior Member

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    Oct 2002
    Posts
    4,569

    Posted On:
    2/25/2005 6:45pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Be Happy

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Areas of Indonesia, Malaysia, South Asia/ South East Asia has some pretty rough neighbourhoods. I guess it shouldnt be far fetch to find some pretty tough guys who can actually fight and probably have some knife/war wounds to show.
    Ghost of Charles Dickens
  10. Fantasy Warrior is offline
    Fantasy Warrior's Avatar

    Misguided style basher

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    2,714

    Posted On:
    2/26/2005 7:40am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kata

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by LLL
    The 'Alexander the Great's Pankration = Asian MAs' is an unproven myth, though... 'Western Martial Arts' supremacists like to say that, but there's zero proof...
    Western MA supremacists? lol. the thing is that there iasn't any contradicting evidence either so both 'sides' are speculating. The Alexander theory holds logic -not that many would suggest that ALL eastern MAs come COMPLETELY from Pankration -but the influence is logical. :XXhesitan
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