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  1. patfromlogan is offline
    patfromlogan's Avatar

    Heavyweight

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    Hilo Island of Hawaii
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    Posted On:
    2/16/2005 10:48am

    supporting member
     Style: Kyokushinkai / Kajukenbo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Meex
    As for philosophy. . .
    When I was in Japan we were invited to watch Yokozuna Akebono/Chad Rowan train, and to visit with him and his oyakata/(stablemaster Takamiyama/Jesse Kuhaulua, at Jesse's beya/stable/gym.

    The new guys who were not able to do splits were allowed to go as low as possible, and then upper ranks would lean/sit on their backs,and force them down to the ground in excruciating pain, which most took without crying out, but, not all. One guy. . .you could almost "hear" the muscle tear.

    Jesse explained that even though it looks very painful, the pain would subside, and the miscles will heal, and the training could continue later with no ill effects of the tears, even making the muscle stronger, and it was quicker for the sthlete than waiting to be able to stretch.

    pain = pain

    `~/

    LIke OUCH! (though I've heard that those Hawaiian Kempo guys say, "Ouch is not a Kempo term).
    "Preparing mentally, the most important thing is, if you aren't doing it for the love of it, then don't do it." - Benny Urquidez
  2. Edge is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/16/2005 11:25am


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by [Shizo]
    PO9: Thank you! YUM YUM

    Edge: Thanks for your critisism. Unfortunately the Stadion stretching philosophy goes against Shaolin stretching philosophy (that is, more pain = more gain).

    Meex: Thanks! I'll look into it, maybe the links are broken.

    In the end, i made this article so that people could use it as a stretching guide if they think it's good. I'm not saying it's right to do one way or the other.
    Any kinesiologist will tell you that realisitically stretching through pain is not gain. I know that my Univ. profs and Bill Wallace have told me that personally.

    Martial Arts teachers are supposed to be open minded. If you show whoever it is that you train under at Shaolin the research they may allow some small changes at a time. When I approached my teacher about changing the stretching regime he was reluctant to change anything at first, but after a couple conversations about it, he saw things my way.

    The other thing to remember about Shaolin stretching is that those who begin training at 4 or 5, start with Tong Zi Gong (Virgin Gong Fu). Then they keep this routine for as long as they train. This means that they have had the maximum range of motion dynamically and static reach, since they were very young and have maintained it through the rest of their martial careers. So do they feel pain in their stretching? Hell NO.

    But the majority of Martial Artists in the world do not start at the age of 4 or 5. I would say that most start when they are teens (I could be wrong). And when the majority do start MA, they don't start with Tong Zi Gong, and they shouldn't. Static stretching is not what you need to apply your MA anyways, you need dynamic range of motion. Therefore this is what the majority of the MA world should be focusing on.
  3. [Shizo] is offline

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    Feb 2005
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    China
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    Posted On:
    2/16/2005 7:22pm


     Style: Shaolin, Sanda

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm training under a Shaolin shifu who trained 10 years in (edit)Shaolin Temple and WuShu Guan.
    Their schedule was from 6 to 8 hours a day training with one day off per week.

    Western training philosophies are different from Asian. Believe it.
    Last edited by [Shizo]; 2/16/2005 9:13pm at .
  4. TaeBo_Master is offline
    TaeBo_Master's Avatar

    Certified Fitness Trainer

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    Mar 2003
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    San Antonio, TX
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    4,002

    Posted On:
    2/16/2005 7:36pm

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: Judo, Jujitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There shouldn't be a separation between "Western" and "Eastern" anymore when it comes to physical training. There should only be "scientific" and "unscientific"
    Click To Get My Free Training Newsletter... Do It NOW!


    "You all just got fucking owned.";
    "TaeBo_Master and GajusCaesar just scored 10,000,000 points on all you pawns."

    - The Wastrel
  5. Nid is offline

    Light Heavyweight

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    Oct 2003
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    Posted On:
    2/16/2005 10:03pm

    supporting member
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    TBM,

    That's crap. Russians are strongest cuz of kettlebells.
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