Thread: Wall-bag Training
2/14/2005 6:40pm, #61
Uhm, I hit really hard, and I can break things without breaking or cutting my hands, and I've never done any makiwara hitting. "Hard hands" don't come from calluses or bone density - they come from good hand alignment while hitting. No amount of callusing the knuckles could develp and protect your entire hand - only good body geometry while hitting can do that.
I have read (and I unf. forget where) that the practice of striking objects to increase "bone strength" in several cultures goes back to various antiquated sciences that related bone to other materials, and supposed that they could be compacted and tempered like metal. I couldn't verify it with a quick google, but it seems like an interesting theory.
And why, in the name of pissing fire, would anybody make armour out of bamboo, when you could use metal or leather or anything else?
2/14/2005 7:11pm, #62
Hitting hard objects to train a punch is silly. Subconsciously, your brain won't allow you to hit as hard as you would if the object wasn't hard."Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." – Voltaire.
2/14/2005 10:51pm, #63
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Hitting hard objects worked for Mas Oyama, didnt the guy break a bull's horn?
The real advantage is that is such things destroy your nerves over time, you could hit anything as hard you want and no pain.
2/14/2005 10:52pm, #64
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You would also lose the ability to type, so I highly recommend it.
2/14/2005 11:15pm, #65
v1o is right. Who the hell wants nerves in their hands? Pesky things just get in the way.
Last edited by JohnnyS; 2/14/2005 11:17pm at . Reason: Spelling
2/15/2005 8:01am, #66
From my personal experience from doing both Makiwara training and heavy bag training I can tell you this, hitting the heavy bag will make you a more "powerful" puncher than hitting a makiwara.
Now, THAT said, Makiwara, wall-bag, breaking and things of that nature are tools that can help, IF you understand what it is they are helping.
A makiwara has quite a bit of give, not as much as a regular heavy bag, and less than some of those 200lbs sand bag monsters, so you can drill a makiwara pretty good and not worry too much about "give", heck I have broken a few Makiwara's in my time, so have a few people I know.
The wall bag is NOT a tool to drive full force, full bodyweight, strikes into, it is more of a "focus" developer, a wrist and impact "conditioner".
Anyone that tells you that damaging your hands will make you punch harder is an ass.
2/15/2005 8:52am, #67
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yes if you hit with full power and large volume of punches you will eventually damage your joints over time
Again punching rock/steel ball bearings filled wall bags is just going to cripple your hands use rice or mid-large size beans instead
2/15/2005 11:07am, #68
MEGA JESUS-SAN and Ronin69 are correct, Japanese Samurai battle armor was traditionally made out of laquered iron, for the big shots on the horses, and laquered leather, for the poor lowly foot soldiers.
However a Samurai Jingasa, a flat, round, laquered bamboo hat with a wide brim, usually displaying your family crest, or clan kamon, was normally worn during parades and official ceremonies. These are often called helmets, simply because they're worn by soldiers, but they are definitely not meant for battle.
And Grond, "increasing bone density" has only one interpretation, it means, literally, increasing the density of your bones. You made decide, personally, that it means something else, but that's just ridiculous, that would be like me deciding to rename dogs as elephants, or the color blue as yellow. Hitting harder can be produced by all kinds of different reasons, but the alternate reasons you're suggesting are incorrect. Dead nerves don't make you hit harder, they would just prevent you from feeling anything. Not feeling anything has nothing to do with hitting harder. Most of your ability to hit hard is produced by the things that happen, the things that you do, before impact. And anything you do, or have, that would cushion the shock of the impact would only work to weaken your strikes, that's what a cushion does, that's why you wear boxing gloves when you spar, to weaken the impact of your punches.
2/15/2005 8:43pm, #69
'that's why you wear boxing gloves when you spar, to weaken the impact of your punches."
Strange, I always thought it was to increase the surface area of the impact."Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." – Voltaire.
2/16/2005 12:02am, #70
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I thought boxing gloves were to prevent you from breaking bones in your hand since lb per lb, boxers have the hardest punches. (Of ocurse, the gloves gradually got more and more padded to help "protect" the opponent, but originally it was just to prevent the boxer's fracture and similar accidents)