Goshin Jutsu...Complete bullshido or viable MA?

**Nasrudin** · Posted On: 1/22/2005 10:57pm

Ive been training in MMA for about a year a half now, i realize that isnt very long and i certainly dont claim to be able to submit any grappler or out-do a pro kickboxer, but in my opinion im not that bad for my small amount of experience. But anyway, back to Goshin Jutsu...just recently i went to my friends Goshin school, just from the name I figured it would be a joke, but i decided to keep an open mind and give it a whirl anyway. After going there from what i saw they did a whole crap ton of katas, punches from the hip, and tons of other stupid crap. Also to add to that 3 Goshin guys came to our school for some grappling fun, like i said i dont claim to be the best..but these guys were a joke. They all had a huge size advantage over me(and ill admit my tech. isnt good enough to be able to compensate for what they had in sheer muscle, ive got alot to learn :) ) Anyway, after a few hours of grappling i had managed to be completely even with all 3 of them(who were all like 10+ years experience and black belts) and they didnt even come near my instructor to grapple with him. From what ive seen this style is just traditional, yet no matter what i say my friend insists that they do a modern form of martial arts with not only full contact fighting but grappling also.
What I was wondering is if anyone has any info on this style that i may not have experienced and maybe prove my friend actually is right.( Id like him to maybe not be taking a completely BS martial art)

A few links to Gohsin sites are provided(my friends school doesnt have a site)
http://www.goshinjutsukarate.com/
http://www.goshinjutsu.org/

**albert** · Posted On: 1/22/2005 11:47pm

I guess there's a difference between Goshin Jitsu and Goshin Jutsu, because Goshin Jitsu seems pretty legit, at least at UIUC ( https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/ro/www/GoshinJitsu/ ). Shonie Carter and Brian Gassaway have done seminars for their club.

**bushi51** · Posted On: 1/23/2005 1:10am

First lets look at the terms.

Goshin means Self-defense.

Jitsu is more often used to mean System or art, but actually means truth.

Jutsu means system or art and is the more legitimate/current form of spelling the Japanese kanji.

The Kodokan has a whole set of Kata known as Goshin jutsu no kata.

This art is probably a shameless rip-off of that.

**Zeddy** · Posted On: 1/23/2005 1:45am

Bushi is right in that goshin means self defence. When it's tacked onto the name of a school, that doesn't necessarily mean they're part of any larger organisation.

That said, I have been to a goshin place. They trained in the back shed of the sensei, and had very little kata. Their syllabus consisted pakua, hsing-i, judo and seidokaikan karate if I recall correctly.

It was a strange mix, but yeah they were full contact, and the upper grades at least knew their stuff.

**SamHarber** · Posted On: 1/23/2005 10:40am

When I first started japanese jujitsu in the early 90's, it was a Goshin club.
It was pretty much your usual unrealistic ineffective stuff. Fortunately the two instructors were pretty open minded, one was a regular street fighter (he'd get in drunken fights every couple of weeks or so) so he incorporated a lot of what had worked for him, and the other guy was a lot more intelligent, and would do a lot of research and training with other styles to see what actually worked for them. There was some (but not a lot) of full contact sparring.
I don't recall them being part of any association.

**Gezere** · Posted On: 1/23/2005 12:33pm

Originally Posted by bushi51

First lets look at the terms.

Goshin means Self-defense.

Jitsu is more often used to mean System or art, but actually means truth.

Jutsu means system or art and is the more legitimate/current form of spelling the Japanese kanji.

The Kodokan has a whole set of Kata known as Goshin jutsu no kata.

This art is probably a shameless rip-off of that.

In this case Jitsu and Jutsu actually represents the same kanji (in this case method, technique) Just like you can romanize Jujitsu, Jiu Jitsu, or Jujutsu and they are all essentially correct.

Basicly it seems a westerner took a japanese term and named his art. Its been done many times.

**Wounded Ronin** · Posted On: 1/23/2005 1:46pm

I think there was a thread about this on e-budo.com.

**godfrey** · Posted On: 1/25/2005 12:24pm

YES, Goshin Jutsu means self-defense in Japanese, regardless of the way you spell it.
There are goshin jutsu sillabuses in several martial arts, but it's the very first time I hear of a school of that name. In all cases, it should be classified self-defense and be affiliated to self-defense federations (if any in the US???).
Whatever, self-defense CANNOT be done full contact unless you wear heavy protective gear (an armor or a dogs training wear, with a helmet) because most of the strikes are supposed to be very damaging (we're talking about full power sidekicks on the side of the knee and that kind of stuff here)...similar to military self-defense or close-combat...
So good luck with the new name.

**Andy Kaufman** · Posted On: 7/12/2005 4:05pm

i used take goshin jutsu when i was a kid.

i switched to BJJ.

that system has no BJJ nor do they train MMA.

they are primarily sport karate w/ some japanese jiu-jitsu & aikido

**goshinkaratekid** · Posted On: 11/02/2007 8:40pm

I have a black belt in goshin jutsu. Here's the problem - Durants history was made up everyone knows it. When he died the systems politics when to hell. Here's the good thing One of Durants students actually is really good and their are a few groups that gravitate towards his teachings. That group has branched out and is learning alot from other styles. I personaly have taken Aikido from a school that is a branch of Capital Aikikia. I found that the principles of the body mechanics were dead on.

There are many goshin jutsu schools that I would not want to be affiliated with. They have become watered down. As far as the school connected to goshinjutsukarate.com they are good. The teacher there is probably the second best guy in the system. He is also a kenjutsu black belt and his school in particular is affiliated with an aikido school that is connected to capital aikikia.
that second link goshinjutsu.org - He broke off from the system when Durant died and as far as I know He was promoted by his students to grandmaster (bullshit). He is not affiliated with any other goshin jutsu schools that I know of and the history section is wrong. Everyone knows it even durants son stated it somewhere on the internet. It was a fabrication by durants students and he never argued it so it spread.

I have seen many other martial arts and took shotokan for a while in college. I think the stuff I learned in goshin jutsu was better, Its not as rigid as shotokan and we actually had instruction during sparring instead of a lot of other schools that just throw you out in a ring and tell you to throw some punches and kicks.

So my point is its hit or miss. If you get into the right school its an evolving art that is practical. If you don't your going to get something really sports karate influenced and kinda crappy.

Here is the actual history: http://defendwithhonor.com/articles/article2.html

the schools affiliated with this site are the best good ones. I personally think that my style is great