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  1. Thaiboxerken is offline
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    Genius

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2005 1:46pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kru-MuayThai,GJJ-Blue

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I primarily use trapping to bridge gaps, if I'm not shooting for a takedown.
    "Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire.
  2. ESP is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/25/2005 2:19pm


     Style: Jeet Kune Do practitioner

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The way Bruce wanted JKD to be is a personal journy through what is the most logically efficient way to fight for an individual. Talking about any one elses views on it, or 'ways to teach it' is a complete waste of time.

    Accept what is usefull, reject what is useless.

    Learn everything you can.
  3. Thaiboxerken is offline
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    Genius

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2005 2:29pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kru-MuayThai,GJJ-Blue

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Shut the **** up, ESP. Enough with the Bruce Lee nut-hugging. Change your avatar.
    "Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire.
  4. ESP is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/26/2005 6:02pm


     Style: Jeet Kune Do practitioner

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Please, explain how I was hugging Bruce Lee's nuts. Or maybe you're just mad because you're retarded.
  5. Thaiboxerken is offline
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    Genius

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    Posted On:
    1/26/2005 6:10pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kru-MuayThai,GJJ-Blue

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Your nut-hugging avatar says it all. That, and your quoting of Lee as your post.
    "Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire.
  6. wingchunnewbie is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/26/2005 7:01pm


     Style: Wing Chun

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by TylerDurden
    McJKD is some guy who has a couple years of TKD, maybe a year of Karate of some kind, took a seminar in Judo once and has a really nice collection of Roy Harris video's. This guy then opens a school, and calls it JKD, claims to teach all ranges of combat and has posters of Bruce Lee everywhere. That's McJKD to me.
    What about a guy who blended a few years of Wing Chun with a bit of boxing.... ?
  7. Phoenix is offline
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    Stand and Deliver!

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    Posted On:
    1/26/2005 7:30pm

    supporting member
     Style: JKD Concepts, Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by 5FingazofDeath
    Your right on point with the range flow, but Im not so sure about the traps. I know they were considered a important thing to do, but now it seems PFS has considered traps (actual trapping - not the range) low priority.
    What?? You're joking, right?
    "Onward we stagger, and if the tanks come, may God help the tanks." - Col. William O. Darby
  8. Thaiboxerken is offline
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    Genius

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    Posted On:
    1/26/2005 7:46pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kru-MuayThai,GJJ-Blue

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by wingchunnewbie
    What about a guy who blended a few years of Wing Chun with a bit of boxing.... ?
    McJKD all the way. It must have Jun Fan to be considered JKD.
    "Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire.
  9. Japan Junkie is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/27/2005 3:52am


     Style: TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Thaiboxerken
    Yes, even the crappiest schools can acquire a talented fighter that makes their system look good.

    Thaiboxerken was right on the money with this one. This is important to keep in perspective because many schools do just this, hire a talented fighter or teacher to make their own art look good, giving people the illusion that crappy JKD can be good if this coordinated guy can do it (not knowing the history of the fighter or the school's instructors). Usually, an instructor might hire someone with talent because it helps to "legitimate" the crappy JKD that unfortunately proliferates in many different directions these days. There are a lot of good schools out there, but there are also a lot of bad ones. You must learn to separate the two.

    As far as what "JKD" is, you're somewhat correct. It is a philosophy more than a system. However, I don't think it would be fair to mix TKD and BJJ and call yourself a JKD practitioner. Bruce Lee really should be somewhere in the lineage, simply because it does a person well to learn the reasons behind Lee's philosophy. Jun Fan Gung Fu is not JKD, but without Jun Fan Gung Fu, there is no JKD. It's my opinion that Jun Fan Gung Fu should be learned by anyone that is doing "JKD". However, their own interpration of JKD can end it's similarities with other JKD'ers at that point. JKD isn't a system or just a philsophy, it's incorporates the training as well.
    The lineage certainly helps. At least if the connection to Lee stands (if there are some kinds of standards that are maintained, for instance), it will probably ensure a decent amount of quality down the line. If the person that one is learning from has decent skills, it is definitely going to enhance the quality of the students. Some guys are great students but terrible teachers, translating into bad karate/jkd/whatever and leading into bad students opening up even worse karate schools. At some point, people can probably get a hint of this by looking at the school quality. It really doesn't matter if the person is slow, or old, but how many of the black belts are horribly overweight or out-of-shape? I would say if they have a HUGE kids' program that looks more like glorified baby-sitting, or the instructors hit the bars after every class, it's probably not a good sign. One of the best ways to ensure decent quality schools is to see who the instructors are accountable to.

    If there is a higher authority in charge (like a grandmaster), this can be one of the best forms of quality control. We are all accountable to somebody above us at work or school; if an instructor declares himself the grand inquisitor, subject to 0% criticism by his peers and declaring that his style is the best, then I think we have a problem. Otherwise, an art that centers around the founder develops into a personality cult, with lackeys developing all around with less regard to a qualified order of succession and more emphasis put into ensuring that there are an ample number of toadies in sight, there is nothing left once the founder passes, or a student moves on. A way to resolve this might be to seek out the teachers who have an open-door policy about learning and appreciating the various martial arts that exist out there; the opposite would be to live in a bubble, further encapsulating the practioners of that particular school and perpetuating the myth that the art itself indeed works and that, through selective invitations only of seminars that are deemed "appropriate," many individuals will be filtered information through a massive propaganda machine of that certain system. Without an outside lens to observe or constructive criticism allowed, the martial artists themselves become fascinated with their own abilities and stoop so low as to start promoting each other, hence further adding to the legend behind the personality cult, or the particular way of a system.

    Unfortunately, without a scale by which to measure the performance of the art, it becomes moot knowledge, in a sense, and remains static, forever weakened by the severe handicaps of the followers, who possess neither the strategic incentive to further advance the art and remain perpetually satisfied in a way that can only be compared to a heroin addict on a high, in a blissful state of ignorance. In a sense, these severe handicaps by the followers give critics no further cause than to say that the art, because of its limitations, can no longer be considered martial, but merely a series of techniques (or wild kicks, punches, or just plain sophisticated wigglings of the arms and legs, if this may so indeed be aptly preferred) that may do no more than impress the ignorant, cause the experienced practioners to scoff, and lead the truly gullible to get locked into a lengthy contract of epic proportions, further causing one to be discombobulated, not gaining any semblance of the enlightenment that can be gained, for example, when a genuine art of superior quality is practiced in comparison after many years. Ultimately, the martial artist himself determines the path that is laid out for him, and he must possess the ability to decipher the code, per se, the language of combat, that enables him to separate the highly sophisticated instructors who possess a dearth of teaching knowledge, an awareness factor that comes from observing several systems, from the simple-minded buffoon who convinces himself and his (inferiors) that the microcosm that he truly represents in the martial arts world, that in existing in his own alternate universe (of which he is at the epicenter), the unfortunate circumstance comes down to the mere fact that he is one-dimensional, displaying troglodyte-like tendencies, refusing to evolve beyond the Stone Age when the rest of the human race has already passed the Bronze Age and beyond.
  10. wingchunnewbie is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/27/2005 5:00am


     Style: Wing Chun

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Thaiboxerken
    McJKD all the way. It must have Jun Fan to be considered JKD.
    Why ? Jun Fan is Bruce's own mix of Wing Chun, Boxing, some footwork from western fencing and some kicks of his own.
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