Real RBSD

**Aesopian** · Posted On: 12/08/2004 11:01am

With all the "dim-mak waveform striking" and "no touch sparring" and other utterly useless threads as of late, I've decided to start this thread in a vain attempt at some real martial arts discussion. I imagine this topic has been done countless times before, but I didn't bother using the search function because I'm hoping for some fresh non-retarded discussion.

I'm interested in hearing how those of us in "combat sports" (BJJ, MT, MMA, etc.) train specifically for self defense, besides, you know, choking people and punching them in the face.

GrappleArts.com brings up some interesting ideas in its piece Grappling for Self Defense and gives you an idea of what kind of drills I'm looking for:

Include finger grabbing and (gentle) finger locks
Include hair pulling
Simulate biting and (very gentle) eye-gouging
Work on your headlock escapes. Skilled opponents rarely try using the headlock, but if a strong and desperate person gets hold of your noggin and squeezes it is always difficult to get out.
Wear a gi and include striking or simulated striking. Most of the time when people practice MMA they are wearing T-shirts or spandex: having a gi to grab and pull can change things dramatically.
Try grappling against two partners at the same time: your goal is to either submit them both or to be able to stand up and clear distance
Grapple with a dowel, simulating a knife. This drill will really emphasize the importance of wrist control!
Grapple with a rattan stick: you can use the stick to strike, to lock, to choke and to implicitly. The Dog Brothers are geniuses at doing this.

Do you do anything similar at your school? What drills do you use in striking arts?

**Roidie McDouchebag** · Posted On: 12/08/2004 11:24am

Include finger grabbing and (gentle) finger locks

This is honestly a horrible idea when sparring...learning how is one thing, I know how to use fingerlocks, but sparring using them is asking for sprained and broken fingers. Besides that, breaking someone's finger isn't going to seriously impede their ability to continue attacking. The only use I find for these is controlling people who aren't seriously resisting.

In fact, I think that applies to most of the above "techiniques". That isn't to say you shouldn't learn how, but if you learn to grapple and strike without them, you should be able to add them in seemlessly when you need to...sparring with them is asking for unnecessary injuries.

However, training with a gis or weapons will seriously alter the situation, and I think training for that is a good thing. However I think the Dog Brothers are insane and their sort of sparring is, again, asking for unnecessary injuries.

**Aesopian** · Posted On: 12/08/2004 11:29am

From the same article, to show he's not advocating breaking all your fingers and getting your eyes fucked out of your skull:

I'm not suggesting that you explore these scenarios very often - once every month or two is perfectly adequate for self defense considerations. Also you want to do these sparring sessions with someone you trust, NOT the class spaz or the guy with the huge ego. You need to approach these sessions with an attitude of discovery, not competition. Thinking outside the box every couple of months will dramatically increase your ability to take your art out into the real world.

I am hoping the insanity of the Dog Brothers could be overlooked for the purposes of this thread.

**Roidie McDouchebag** · Posted On: 12/08/2004 11:36am

Well, I think it's a good idea to keep these things in mind...but I never needed anyone to tell me that, I figured it was just common sense.

**STR33T GUY** · Posted On: 12/08/2004 11:43am

What I Choke You said

**Aesopian** · Posted On: 12/08/2004 11:52am

If I've learned anything from Bullshido, it's that there is no such thing as common sense.

**Roidie McDouchebag** · Posted On: 12/08/2004 12:04pm

Sad but true.

**Aesopian** · Posted On: 12/08/2004 12:13pm

I remember reading a thread where some RBSD-type getting hounded for pages because he said he would use ear ripping and all the usual "dirty tricks" in a real fight. He felt it would just be "common sense" for him to use them, but he was severely criticized with the argument "How do you know these 'dirty tricks' work if you've never tried them in sparring?"

I'm not arguing for dirty tricks, but what I am interested in is how our side of this argument trains to deal with them. Most of them are pretty easy to deal with, and I will admit that the mythical "common sense" would seem to handle them for you, but I'm wondering what more formal training has been formulized for them, if any.

But saying you don't change anything to train for self defense is also a valid answer, so I'm interested in hearing that too.

**Ronin** · Posted On: 12/08/2004 12:17pm

We used to have a "street clothes" session once a month, you wear old clothes you didn't mind ripping and jeans and you do your stuff, no warm ups.
I think the two things that shoud be stressed in "self defence" session are armed and multiple attackers.

**Aesopian** · Posted On: 12/08/2004 12:25pm

In self defense training with weapons, what is considered a "win" or at what point is the drill restarted? I can take a few more wodden dowels to the stomach than I can take knives, so I'm wondering how you do these.