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View Poll Results: How do you pass the guard?

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  • From standing.

    25 31.65%
  • From the knees.

    54 68.35%
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  1. Aesopian is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/22/2004 3:09pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     Aesopian.com 

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Whoops, try it now. Some of those other details are important, if you want to escape straight into a guard pass.
  2. TylerDurden is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/22/2004 3:09pm


     Style: BJJ/Judo/HapKiDo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well the escape Aesop showed above is sort of what I meant by stacking to escape the triangle once you are inside it. Good posture prevents it from getting set in to begin with. So it's sort of two different things. I am not sure about the boundry issue, they might just reset you in the center but I don't know.

    The triangle escape I have used/seen mostly you take your free shoulder and try to push their leg to their head. Even if they are flexible it creates space in the triangle. I am probably not explaining it well enough though.
    Is Wayne Brady gonna have to choke a bitch?
  3. Aesopian is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/22/2004 3:14pm

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yeah, driving their leg with the free shoulder doesn't seem like it would stop them from getting out to the side with a better angle on your neck.
  4. TylerDurden is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/22/2004 3:29pm


     Style: BJJ/Judo/HapKiDo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    See this is why I am not an instructor. You have to hold them in place, a cross grab to their gi as I recall. It's nearly identical to the one on bjj.org except the angle of attack is a little closer to their body. And you grab the gi collar with your free hand to secure it. That's the way I do it anyways, we have not done them in class for awhile so I could be wrong on the proper way we were taught them.
    Is Wayne Brady gonna have to choke a bitch?
  5. Boogyman is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/22/2004 5:55pm

    supporting member
     Style: MMA (and others)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    MAN!!! Where are you guys when I WANT somebody to stack me to get out of my triangle?!?!?
    I'll let you in on a little secret...if you stack me in the triangle I'm gonna sweep your ass, and if you base to prevent the sweep I'm gonna armbar you (or omoplata), and if you pull away from the armbar I'm gonna kneebar you (or go back to the triangle on the other side).
    So what do you do (provided as a last resort)? Instead of stacking the lower part of the body over the head;
    1) try keeping your good posture and line them up with you (they want to be 90 or better, so don't give it to them),
    2) reach the hand that is inside the triangle around and under your opponent (they are trying to push it across your neck--again don't give it to them-),
    3) grab and pull LOW (try to pull them along the ground/if you can't pull them push yourself LOW into them) KEEP THE ARM THAT IS INSIDE LOW TO THE MAT,
    4) now hug the hips to you (squeeze your lats),
    5) now you should be in position to do a stacked guard pass (as long as you kept everything LOW you will be fine).
    6) PUT YOUR KNEE INTO THEIR BUTT/LEG and leverage in and down (use your legs/arms/back/everything-the leg also prevents them from attacking for the armbar), then stack as in the regular stacking guard pass and pass the legs.


    -note you will also have to re-grip at some point to avoid being leveraged against yourself. Play with it see what works for you.

    You will have to watch out for:
    1) them going after the arm that is under them, i.e. shoulder locks etc. This is why you must keep that arm LOW to the mat (makes it diff for them to chase it-if they do go for it-makes it easier for you to get out of the triangle). Be very carefull at the end there as that is where you will get shoulder locked.
    2) Armbars-use your knee in the butt and leverage-Leverage-LEVERAGE.
    3) As long as you have kept that arm/leg low, it's very difficult to be omoplata-ed (you have to change positions).
    4) Sweeps-this is a tough one as anyone with a good triangle will have a fairly good sweeping offense. But as long as you maintain a LOW balanced state (head up and based out) you will be fine.
    5) Leg locks/Footlocks- This is usually done following a sweep (depending on where the opponents end up), but they can and usually are set up through "regular" submission attempts.

    Oh yeah, and there is not a "both" option. I honestly feel pretty good at both.
    Last edited by Boogyman; 12/22/2004 5:57pm at . Reason: forgot about the poll...
    [A friend once told me he found Jennifer Connelly hot.
    "Would she still be hot if she were melting in a car wreck, like at the end of Pollock, smelling of burnt hair and bubbling intestines?" I asked.
    "Oh hell yeah."
    "How? How would you even have sex with her?"
    "Just let her cool and fold her over, like an omolette."
    Since then we've always had this universal sign for Jennifer Connelly, it's like an "opening a book" motion, only backwards. And we are often known to softly remark "....like an omolette".]--boyd
  6. Bang! is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/22/2004 6:22pm

    supporting memberBullshido Newbie
     Style: Wu Style TCC + BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Excellent post, Boogyman!
  7. TylerDurden is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/22/2004 7:22pm


     Style: BJJ/Judo/HapKiDo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You cannot sweep or omoplata if your hips are pinned though. Which is the end result of being stacked and passed the way I am trying to get across. I have worked this particular escape against purple and even a good brown belt, though admittedly I can get away with it because of size and strength advantages. I am not saying it's good BJJ, but there is also a legit escape in a similiar way I am just not getting it across very well.
    Is Wayne Brady gonna have to choke a bitch?
  8. Gumby is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/22/2004 11:06pm


     Style: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by TylerDurden
    You cannot sweep or omoplata if your hips are pinned though. Which is the end result of being stacked and passed the way I am trying to get across. I have worked this particular escape against purple and even a good brown belt, though admittedly I can get away with it because of size and strength advantages. I am not saying it's good BJJ, but there is also a legit escape in a similiar way I am just not getting it across very well.
    That particular escape is good BJJ- your opponent cant armbar you when you hold his hips down- he HAS to lift his hips in order to armbar/omoplata you.


    Boogyman, Im kinda confused as to what you're saying- did you suggest taking the arm thats inside the triangle out, or are you suggesting wrapping the leg from the outside with that arm?
  9. Te No Kage! is offline
    Te No Kage!'s Avatar

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    Posted On:
    12/23/2004 12:49am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ/Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    worked both escapes tonight.... during ne waza randori and I let our BJJ blue belt put me in the triangle just to work on these escapes.

    1) stacking escape -- my BJJ guy told me that it works for me because I'm keeping my inside arm on my same side (keeping it from being crossed like Boogyman said), then I base out with my one leg to keep it from being swept, and then usually I can get one arm slightly in then both out for the stacking guard pass -- although he did tell me that I could possibly be open for an omoplata if I wasn't careful when I was backing out

    2) the posting escape -- I found this to work pretty good. I was almost full-triangled (chin was in) and did this with my eyes covered by pants and it still worked like a charm. The only difference in the way I did it than Aesopian's picture was that I based way out with both legs so that I was like a tripod with my two feet and my head on the mat. The only thing I don't like about it is that I end up back in the guard, and that's not someplace I really want to be.

    Probably though, while rolling, I'll try method 1 and then if it doesn't work out like I'm going to be choked out I'll go to method 2.
    "Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration." -A. Lincoln

    Vote your conscience.... Vote Libertarian!
  10. Boogyman is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/23/2004 9:10am

    supporting member
     Style: MMA (and others)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    "Boogyman, Im kinda confused as to what you're saying- did you suggest taking the arm thats inside the triangle out, or are you suggesting wrapping the leg from the outside with that arm?"--Gumby

    In this method I am suggesting that you take the arm that is inside the triangle (lets say the left arm and head are in). You would take the left arm and reach under the right side of your opponent (this will open up the legs and make it damn near impossible to close the triangle). Once you reach under your opponent, grab your hand with your other hand and work to pin their left leg to their own body (while keeping a solid base). This sets you up into the stacking guard pass I reffered to earlier. REMEMBER TO STACK AT THE HIPS/LOWER TORSO if you stack higher you can (and if you face someone really good at sweeps) will be swept (If you have gotten away with it 100 X that's great I am reffering to that one time when it counts).
    Anyway give it a shot and tweak it to work for you. There are many other escapes but I like this one as it seems to work for all body styles (fairly generic with minor tweaking for most people). Good luck!!
    [A friend once told me he found Jennifer Connelly hot.
    "Would she still be hot if she were melting in a car wreck, like at the end of Pollock, smelling of burnt hair and bubbling intestines?" I asked.
    "Oh hell yeah."
    "How? How would you even have sex with her?"
    "Just let her cool and fold her over, like an omolette."
    Since then we've always had this universal sign for Jennifer Connelly, it's like an "opening a book" motion, only backwards. And we are often known to softly remark "....like an omolette".]--boyd
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