Anyone else injoy Dirty boxing as much as me?

**FingerorMoon?** · Posted On: 2/04/2003 5:17pm

Isn't that just sparring ?

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Master of Lay Ze Do
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**sakurabafan** · Posted On: 2/05/2003 12:37am

Actually, no it is just streetfighting. Its one of many aspects of the clinch. The more I work the clinch, the more I realize just how much and how complex the clinch is. Mastering fighting in this range is just as complex as the ground, or stand-up and one can spend several lifetimes and still have more to learn.
Calling striking in the clinch "grabbing and hitting? lol. BASIC streetfighting" is akin to calling submissions "grabbing and twisting. lol. Basic streetfighting". The truth is that the clinch and striking in the clinch has direct street and self-defense application. This is something I feel is overlooked but that should be taught as standard self-defense to interested people. Finally, if you still don't believe that striking from the clinch is just brawling and streetfighting without techinque or principles, then find a good Muay Thai gym, or a MMA gym, or a Greco wrestler and fight in the clinch with any of these folks. I'm sure you will change your mind after such an encounter.

**J-kid** · Posted On: 2/05/2003 12:45am

good post sakurabafan.

**sakurabafan** · Posted On: 2/05/2003 10:16am

Osiris:

Let me share with you something my Ju-jitsu coach likes to say "there are no advanced moves, just the basics done with greater timing and sensitivity."

Striking while clinched is the same. Sure you can grab a guy's head and throw hook after hook, but you have to prepared to defend the duck under on the side you hook from, or the brace and re-tie up, or pummeling for underhooks while your swinging away. In order to effectively strike in the clinch you must know how to control in the clinch, and what openings you are both creating and giving up. If you are inexperienced in the clinch, its just like any other range (ground or standup) you will find yourself quickly being controlled and dominated.

Again, clinching and striking from the clinch can be seen in many streetfights, its a natural range of human combat, just like the ground or standup. But to effectively use it and not get thown, control your opponent, or get struck yourself requires training and technique. Let me give an example- we've all seen a right cross thrown in a street fight, Yes? We wouldn't say that a right cross is simply street fighting, especially not to a boxer or a striker that trains in the standup range. No, instead we would respect the power, timing, and reactions of a boxer to know that this technique can hurt us or put us in serious trouble, more so than an random drunk looking for a fight.

Again, I urge you to find a Muay Thai gym, or MMA gym, or a Greco wrestler and test and experience the clinch for yourself. Best wishes in your training.

**sakurabafan** · Posted On: 2/05/2003 10:44am

Yes clinching and striking is basic. So is the sprawl, the shot, hand fighting, head positioning, punching, kicking, arm-bars, chokes, and cross-body pin. Everything is basic. Thats really all there is. The better fighter is the one that can apply those basics better than his opponent. That's all.
Nobody here is saying the "dirty boxing" is new, I think the original point is that it is an underused or underappreciated aspect of the fight. I posted on this thread because I feel this way, and thought that some of the other people would like to analyze and discuss some of the particulars. Perhaps someone will start another thread about how much they like neck cranks or right hooks. I will happily post there as well sharing my experiences and looking for new insight. Best wishes to you in your training.

**mystsa** · Posted On: 2/07/2003 1:53pm

If youre into that kinda of thing start Muay Thai. Another good trick is doing the old ice hockey shirt pull (where you grab the back of his shirt and pull it over his head). Can be hard to pull off but really useful and makes him look stupid too.

**DanDavis** · Posted On: 2/08/2003 4:11pm

I'd say I prefer mud wrestling over dirty boxing. :^)

"Strike first! Strike hard! No mercy, sir!"

**PizDoff** · Posted On: 2/08/2003 9:47pm

i like to wave my arms and scream while running at my opponent

There are only three types of people in the world; those who can count and those who can't.

**MM4Guy** · Posted On: 2/09/2003 12:18am

If youre into that kinda of thing start Muay Thai. Another good trick is doing the old ice hockey shirt pull (where you grab the back of his shirt and pull it over his head). Can be hard to pull off but really useful and makes him look stupid too.

But, during Thai fights we fight with no shirt on. Maybe in a street fight this tactic could work, but NOPE. Not in the ring.

Remember the time in the 6th grade where you got your ass-kicked by that 80-pound short-kid? Got BJJ?
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