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  1. Miguksaram is offline
    Miguksaram's Avatar

    Day Tripper/Dream Weaver

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    Sep 2002
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    3,523

    Posted On:
    11/24/2004 2:00pm

    supporting member
     Style: Shorei-ryu & Kumdo & TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Failing as an Instructor

    The Myth of Higher Standards by John Graden

    I do not believe everyone can earn a black belt. However, I do believe that a large percentage of students who could have earned a black belt needlessly dropout before doing so. Sadly, their instructor failed them.

    I work with a lot of instructors who have reached the point that they are sick and tired of being sick and tired about lack of student growth and feeling stuck. The conversation often starts something like this:

    Me: "How long have you had your school?"
    Instructor: "Oh, about ten years."
    Me: "How many black belts have graduated?"
    Instructor (proudly): "Two."
    Me: "You been open ten years and only two people have made black belt?"
    Instructor: "Yep. We have high standards."
    Me: "Higher than West Point? Higher than the NASA astronaut program?"
    Instructor: "I never thought of it that way…"

    This is not a case of higher standards. This is a case of poor leadership. Truthfully, it's easy to be tough and keep students under your thumb. But it's the mark of the professional to take a diverse group of 20 white belts on March 1, 2005 and have 5 – 10 of them actually have a shot at earning their black belt three years later.
    Ok...how many people can find the flaw in this logic to justify black belt mills? Anyone?....Anyone?...That's right, unlike NASA and West Point who's people are exposed 24/7 to their training, the majority of the martial art people take what, an average of 4 hours a week? This is from Graden and his new Martial Arts Teachers Association. This type of logic is what is killing the arts. Just wanted to rant for a bit.
    Jeremy M. Talbott

    Quote Originally Posted by Phrost
    "Bullshido isn't just a place to hang out when you're browsing the net. We really are trying to accomplish something fucking extraordinary here that nobody's ever had the balls to do before."
    Quote Originally Posted by D.Murray
    "Which is better, to learn the truth, or to enjoy the illusion of being right when you are not?"
    Quote Originally Posted by hangooknamja88 View Post
    My definition of Ki is our energy. it's rather hard to explain it in words. It's not some mystical type of energy like white people...


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  2. Peter H. is offline

    Professional Wrestler

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    San Angelo, TX
    Posts
    2,470

    Posted On:
    11/24/2004 2:07pm


     Style: Aikido-Kickboxing-Taichi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I get these all the time as well, freaking MartialInfo sold me and spammed me.
    Be a Blackbelt School...Promote...add stripes...crock of crap.
    My Instrcutor has promoted 6 black belts in the last, I dunno, 15 years or so. 4 of us started at almost the same time and came up the ranks together, and three of us are the only Nidans he has promoted in 20 years.

    It is about high standards, paying youy dues, spending the blood and sweat on the mats. In three years I have just now promoted my first 2nd Kyu. Granted, I have pushed out a lot of 5th kyu's (20 or so), but only 3 (soon to be 4) made it to 4th Kyu. If you can't meet the standards, you don't get the rank.
    "Quiet fool before I am kicking the butt!"
    -My three year old trash talking to me

    "Integrity can't be bought or sold---you either have it or you don't."
    -The Honky Tonk Man

    "If you can't be a shining example, at least be a dire warning."
    -My Father to me one day

    "No surprise. Until Aikido sheds its street-brawling, thuggish image, it'll never be mainstream."
    -Don Gwinn
  3. TylerDurden is offline

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Cheeseland
    Posts
    1,177

    Posted On:
    11/24/2004 2:10pm


     Style: BJJ/Judo/HapKiDo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Not everyone should be able to get a black belt, and there is nothing wrong with high standards. That's what is supposed to make it an accomplishment. I honestly doubt I will ever get a black belt in BJJ. The reason belts mean so little is because they are so easy to get in some arts/schools. That being said, this topic has been done to death.
    Is Wayne Brady gonna have to choke a bitch?
  4. Beatdown Richie is offline
    Beatdown Richie's Avatar

    game dog

    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Munich, Germany
    Posts
    1,886

    Posted On:
    11/24/2004 2:13pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Beside the fact that most people don't train full-time, it really depends what your standards for a black belt are. If it represents an elite fighter who is technically excellent and fully qualified to teach a complex MA system, ten years is still a high number, but in the right order of magnitude. You won't get a Ph.D. in a much shorter time.

    Also, who knows what kind of school it is? It may be in a college town, where most students don't stay much longer than four years. And I don't see "dropping out" as a failure of the instructor either. When people learn what they wanted to learn and then move on, that's fine.
    There are no wrong threats, only wrong answers. (Strategy game truism)
  5. fanatical is offline
    fanatical's Avatar

    Hi, guys

    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    1,291

    Posted On:
    11/24/2004 2:14pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What the hell does martial arts have to do with rocket-science? How can you even make such a comparison?
    More human than human is our motto.
  6. Aesopian is offline

    Light Heavyweight

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    Oct 2011
    Posts
    4,501

    Posted On:
    11/24/2004 2:23pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     Aesopian.com 

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    That comparison makes no sense.

    Chef: We only serve food that passes all of our standards.
    Me: BUT DO YOU TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION THE PLIGHT OF THE AFRICAN PEOPLE?
    Chef: No, I can't say I did...
  7. Bang! is offline
    Bang!'s Avatar

    Light Heavyweight

    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    3,242

    Posted On:
    11/24/2004 2:28pm

    supporting memberBullshido Newbie
     Style: Wu Style TCC + BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Nothing pisses me off like idiotic research methodology. And here we go again. Did it occur to you, Mr. Fuckface, that people attending the livelihood of the people at NASA and WestPoint will be derived from their successes there? MA is, by and large, a hobby for most people.

    What if WestPoint only offered four hours of classes a week (and its students had little outside time to study/practice)? Should they should be able to graduate people within three years?

    Ensuring the same "graduation" rate as any sort of full-time training or schooling would involve watering down your standards enough to ensure that a black belt could be attained by any competent individual who put in four hours a week for a few years. Super.

    Here's an idea for a new article: What if your black belts suck ass and disgrace martial arts as a whole?
  8. Zing! is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    549

    Posted On:
    11/24/2004 2:32pm


     Style: bjj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I wonder what this guy would say about Mas Oyama's black belt standards. Do you think that he'd say that Oyama failed as an instructor because he had such high expectations?
  9. Ronin is offline

    Senior Member

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    Sep 2003
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    20,894

    Posted On:
    11/24/2004 2:36pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Shi Ja Quan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I remember a time when hours of instruction was the deciding factor for WHEN you took any belt test.
  10. inde is offline
    inde's Avatar

    wants jade ring

    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,014

    Posted On:
    11/24/2004 2:56pm

    supporting member
     Style: kung fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I like this ...

    I have taught you the secrets of the martial arts, and you have become adequate warriors. You are now carriers of the living art - for all martial arts are living arts; they grow and change and conform to the needs of each generation of Sensei and disciple. As with all living things, some generations can be stronger or weaker than their ancestors. You must ensure that the living art never becomes weak.

    For our style to live on, you must one day share its secrets with others as I have shared them with you. First, however, you must prove yourselves fit to carry on my name and the style. Go into the world to test your knowledge by fire and by blood. Should you survive long enough for your beards to gray with age, then you will know that your art is strong; then you will know that you are worthy to teach the art.

    But if you should fall from the path, do not disgrace me by teaching your weak version of the art. Better that the style should die than become a tree that appears great for its age, but is rotten and weak inside.
    Author Unknown
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