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  1. Dochter is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2004 12:11pm

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     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WingChun Lawyer
    and the fact that it is cultural does not make it right, not here, not anywhere.

    That said, it was pretty cool.
    Bullshit. Context is always relevant, if for nothing more than guessing whether something was predicatble. It absolutely was here.
  2. Dochter is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2004 12:12pm

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     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Post hoc rationalizations.


    Edit: My point here is that the guy is being called a bully for two reasons 1) he wasn't strictly defending himself and 2) by virtue of his training he knew he could beat the guy down.

    If any of us have done anything like this we should shut the **** up. I haven't been in a fight since I started training and haven't really been in a fight since HS so I can say whatever I want without being a hypocrite.
    Last edited by Dochter; 10/28/2004 12:15pm at .
  3. Matt W. is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/28/2004 12:15pm

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     Style: Judo, TKD BB

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well, it was good to see BJJ in action YET AGAIN... I guess. And I suppose this is more evidence against the "don't ever go to the ground in a streetfight" people. But morally? Totally wrong, man. That fight (on land) was completely unnecessary. He beat that kid out of anger and hate/dislike, not self defense.
  4. Phrost is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/28/2004 12:17pm

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     Guy Who Pays the Bills and Gets the Death Threats Style: MMA (Retired)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Plenty of Lava in Hawaii.
  5. Dochter is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2004 12:17pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yes, there is no question about that.

    The point some are making is that it was completely predictable.
  6. WingChun Lawyer is offline
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    Modesty forbids more.

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2004 12:20pm

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     Style: Muay Thai, BJJ newbie.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Dochter
    Bullshit. Context is always relevant, if for nothing more than guessing whether something was predicatble. It absolutely was here.
    Laws exist in order to prevent this sort of stupidity from happening. Predictable does not equal OK. If you walk into a club in Rio de Janeiro with your wife, the local BJJ bullies may decide to beat you up, since you are a gringo, since you are with a woman, and since you are there. That is predictable, for your information.

    As for post hoc rationalizations, I don´t remember ever seeing a post from ronin stating that putting someone in their place was a correct action. The way I see it, his actions on the Home Depot qualify as legitimate defense of a third party.
    That civilisation may not sink,
    Its great battle lost,
    Quiet the dog, tether the pony
    To a distant post;
    Our master Caesar is in the tent
    Where the maps are spread,
    His eyes fixed upon nothing,
    A hand under his head.


    - W.B. Yeats
  7. Meex is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/28/2004 12:26pm

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     Style: Tao Ga

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hmm. . .
    maybe blond guy was perceived as a threat to himself? His actions putting himself is jeopardy?
    Than, public safety is threatened, and the takedown was justified?
    And, although we couldn't see it in the video (evidence), blondie may have been on the verge of escaping white shirt's control, and thusly white shirt(ed idiot) felt personally in danger, so proceeded to escalate the response?


    ??

    nahhhh. . .
    Last edited by Meex; 10/28/2004 12:36pm at .
  8. Dochter is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2004 12:26pm

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    That is why I wouldn't go into a Rio club with my wife. And can you read? I never said it was okay. I said it was predictable, I also think that there are people that "deserve" an asskicking. In this case it is probably the bjj guy.


    And it is a post hoc rationalization, the party involved flat out said he had not observed that the women in the area were at any risk. He wasn't, he can kick ass. There was no defense involved in the descsion to act.
    Edit: The fact that you don't get this WCL was also reflected in your response to omega's hypothetical poll where a woman flat out assulted his child. You still somehow thought ronin was right in socking the home depot guy, while omega was wrong for threatening the woman, grabbing her, and threatening her spouse.

    Yeah, you're internally consistent.
    Last edited by Dochter; 10/28/2004 12:30pm at .
  9. TheKuzushiKid is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2004 12:33pm


     Style: meku waza

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    First of all, some of you people make Hawaii sound like a fucking awful place to live. And second, obviously there is something wrong with that blond fucker but beating his ass like that didn't help the problem any. If the blond fucktard left and came back with a gun and a few loaded clips the media would be spinning this like it's a terrible tragedy. A bunch of assholes running around defending their turf, their beach, or whatever the hell they are fighting over is insane. Those badass surfers are just lucky, same as that Vegas bum who trashed the car. Most people are cowards and will do anything to get out of a fight, but the fact is there are still a lot of people out there who are just one excuse away from a bloody rampage. If (I know that blondie was too puss for this but), the guy who initiated the ground and pound is lucky that blondie didn't pull a knife and stab the **** out of him.

    And another thing, if Ronin69's story went down exactly as he told it then that bullying asshole was probably arrested for disorderly conduct when the police arrived, Ronin did not put himself in danger of being seriously inured once he initiated his attack, and if my wife was one of those women I'd be very thankful that someone defended her like that. Once a person starts acting like that you have no way of knowing what they will do next; expect the worst. It's a crazy world out there.
    Last edited by TheKuzushiKid; 10/28/2004 12:43pm at .
  10. Dochter is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/28/2004 12:40pm

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     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    A) Most people have heard you don't **** with the ocean scene in regards to hawaiins. I personally don't think it was right, merely predictable.

    B) In ronin's story, at least the initial account, he had no clue that the guy was a threat. The guy was portrayed merely as an ass. The rest came later.

    C) The comments on this thread present the opinion that unless there is an immediate threat of danger to you or someone else, if you beat up an untrained individual you are a bully. All I'm looking for is consistency.
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