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  1. Punisher is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/16/2004 3:03am

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     Style: Five Animal Fighting

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Gracie teams up with XMA and McDojo

    My girlfriend got some free tickets to a local amusement park, so I went to their website to see what rides they had and stuff. I noticed under the events section that they are holding their first ever "Martial Arts Day" on October 30th.

    The highlight of the day is a demonstration called "The Way of the Warrior" being put on my Pallen's Martial Arts, Team CBX, and the Ralph Gracie Jiu-Jitsu Academy.

    We all know who the Gracies are, but who are these other two groups? Well, Pallen's Martial Arts has a chain of schools in Northern California. They teach Kempo and a Philippine martial arts program called Senkotiros. According to their website their goal is to "provide a fun, safe, constructive, and positive environment in which students can learn the basic principles of martial arts." They promote themselves as being "so much more than just self-defense" and as a place where the whole family can train together. Their "formula to a successful class" is "FUN, discipline, high energy, FUN, physical activity, interactive discussions, and MORE FUN!" They are clearly a McDojo.

    Team CBX are being advertised as the National Team Forms Champions. I had a little trouble finding specific information about them online, but I was able to find bios on some of their members. One's nickname is listed as 'Da Grasshoppa, but hell I call myself Punisher, so I can't be too hard on that. Several team members list the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and a primary martial arts influence and the Co-founder describes himself as being goofy and as "super-duper dork".

    So, what is a serious GJJ/MMA gym doing associating with two groups like this? I'll be damned if I know. Should be interesting to see. Anyone in Nor Cal on Oct 30th might want to check out Six Flags Marine World in Vallejo.
  2. MUT is offline
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    Welterweight

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    Posted On:
    10/16/2004 3:17am

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     Style: MuayThai,Igo Ryu Jiujitsu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Maybe just to get together to have some fun??

    Show the superiortity of GJJ over mcdojo arts??
  3. Blad3 is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/16/2004 3:24am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Submission Wrestling.

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Doesn't matter imo, it's just a demo. What are they doing at the park in the first place? Money I suppose.
    "Training = pain." - I said that.

    PizDoff when drunk: "I'm actually MOST pissed that my target for the evening got drink...then I gave her my Bullshido Canada hoodie like a gentleman because she was outside with not much on...did I mention she barfed twice when I got our jackets...steaming barf is kinda fascinating..." - PizDoff.
  4. Ka-Bar is offline
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    is a Godd*mn Federale!

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    Posted On:
    10/16/2004 4:01am

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     Style: Clinchology: Judo & MT

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Punisher - I remember a Pallen's school when I was at UC Davis. It's unfortunate that the instructors, the Pallens, have a legit lineage and some actual skill are not the actual owners of the school, which I believe has led to it's McDojoism.

    Rudy Reyes > Bear Grylls
  5. Punisher is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/16/2004 4:11am

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     Style: Five Animal Fighting

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by MUT
    Show the superiortity of GJJ over mcdojo arts??

    Maybe if they go out there and choke some dude out after he's done a double back flip. Otherwise I have a feeling that anything CBX does will be more impressive to the general public.
  6. Punisher is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/16/2004 4:55am

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     Style: Five Animal Fighting

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ka-Bar
    Punisher - I remember a Pallen's school when I was at UC Davis. It's unfortunate that the instructors, the Pallens, have a legit lineage and some actual skill are not the actual owners of the school, which I believe has led to it's McDojoism.
    Don't get me wrong. I'm not anti-McDojo. Far from it, considering I train at one. To me "McDojo" isn't automatically negative. It simply means that a school is set up to make martial arts accessible to everyone, with a primary focus of fitness and recreation instead of maximizing fighting ability. I actually like training at a place where my girlfriend and I can train together and I don't have to worry if my face will be all messed up when I go to work the next day.

    I like the term "McDojo" because I think the fast-food analogy really applies. Both are designed to cater to the general public, and there are similarities between the two products. Fast-food is designed to taste good, and many McDojos are designed to make a person feel good. Home cooked food might taste better, but takes a lot more effort, sit down restaurant food usually tests better but is a lot more expensive. Putting more time and effort into martial arts can make you feel better by giving you true confidence in your abilities, but there are only so many hours in a day. Paying extra for things like private lessons can make you better, but there is only so much money in your wallet.

    When people start pretending to be what they are not is when they cross the line from McDojo to Bullshido. I don't think too many people would confuse McDonalds, Burger King, or Taco Bell with fine dining or health food, and for the most part they don't promote themselves as such. I don't confuse the place I train with a fighting gym for serious fighters, and the school isn't marketed as such. Now sure every once in a while some new thing pops up that blurs the line a little bit. At that point it's up to us a consumers to make educated decisions about what we are buying and why? Is that 1/2 lb bacon burger really magically good for you now that itís wrapped in lettuce and not on a bun? Will that new technique the instructor is showing me really shatter someone's arm if I need it to?

    Martial arts training, like most things in life, is highly dependent on the effort you put into it. Fast-food places don't have to be unhealthily, and training a McDojo doesn't have to be worthless. If you spend a little time researching the nutrional information, you can usually find at least a couple of things on the menu that aren't quite so bad for you.
    Last edited by Punisher; 10/16/2004 1:24pm at .
  7. Meex is offline
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    Loving Father

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    Posted On:
    10/16/2004 11:13am

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     Style: Tao Ga

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Maybe they should go hang out in Vallejo after dark. . .
  8. The_Ghost is offline
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    U.S. Army

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    Posted On:
    10/16/2004 12:06pm

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     Style: Kickboxing/Shooto

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    [QUOTE=Punisher]
    They promote themselves as being "so much more than just self-defense" and as a place where the whole family can train together. Their "formula to a successful class" is "FUN, discipline, high energy, FUN, physical activity, interactive discussions, and MORE FUN!" They are clearly a McDojo.
    [QUOTE]

    I like you punisher, but this does not make it an automatic McDojo. You notice they say "So much more than self-defense", it doesn't mean that they teach awesome fighting skills they just teach more than self-defense. You gotta look at the wording and they way they put it...not just assume it means they'll be blowing chi out of their asses. Also, it sounds to me like they aren't trying to sell anything else besides a class of martial arts with self-defense. Nothing more, they want you to have fun, get a workout, and maybe protect yourself from roving warbands of assless chaps wearing white guys. And there's nothing wrong with this, besides the fact that they're in the wrong reality and the fact that everyone still has the capabilities to purchase firearms of multiple designs.

    Anyways, I don't want to get into the true depth of this conversation. Suffice to say that they aren't mentioning offering any special powers...just some **** around fun.
    "did Phrost just call me a 'bitch'?"-Omega

    "The collective IQ of bullshido was reduced with the departure of Wastrel. It further dropped due to the retention of (Serious Harm)."
    - The all knowing Dochter

    "but like, it's possible to develop such a level of reflex that you can literally detect someones movements through sensitivity, and block without even thinking"-Apostol

    That's the amazing thing about Ninjas, for sneeky cocksuckers, they are all over the place, like dog **** on your shoe.-Ronin69
  9. Deadpan Scientist is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/16/2004 12:26pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It doesn't sound like they teamed up at all
  10. Punisher is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/16/2004 1:34pm

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     Style: Five Animal Fighting

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    [QUOTE=The_Ghost][QUOTE=Punisher]
    They promote themselves as being "so much more than just self-defense" and as a place where the whole family can train together. Their "formula to a successful class" is "FUN, discipline, high energy, FUN, physical activity, interactive discussions, and MORE FUN!" They are clearly a McDojo.

    I like you punisher, but this does not make it an automatic McDojo. You notice they say "So much more than self-defense", it doesn't mean that they teach awesome fighting skills they just teach more than self-defense. You gotta look at the wording and they way they put it...not just assume it means they'll be blowing chi out of their asses. Also, it sounds to me like they aren't trying to sell anything else besides a class of martial arts with self-defense. Nothing more, they want you to have fun, get a workout, and maybe protect yourself from roving warbands of assless chaps wearing white guys. And there's nothing wrong with this, besides the fact that they're in the wrong reality and the fact that everyone still has the capabilities to purchase firearms of multiple designs.

    Anyways, I don't want to get into the true depth of this conversation. Suffice to say that they aren't mentioning offering any special powers...just some **** around fun.
    Like I said early, I feel there is a difference between McDojo and Bullshido. Teaching a brand of martial arts designed for everyone from 8 to 80, with an emphasis on fun over fighting skills is McDojo. I really don't find anything wrong with that. Representing such a program and the best way to learn how to fight, or making other unrealistic, outlandish claims is Bullshido. There is always something wrong with that.
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