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  1. Aesopian is offline

    Light Heavyweight

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    Posted On:
    10/25/2004 1:21pm

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I would but I "must spread some Reputation around before giving it to WhiteShark again."

    Here's something more for you to try:

    From closed guard, open to spider guard. Grip his right wrist and lapel, and place your left foot on his hip and the other foot on his left biceps. Pull him down to break his posture and kick the foot on the biceps over his shoulder and hook his neck. Use the other foot on his hip to get the proper angle for the triangle, then cross your legs and finalize the choke. As always, be sure to keep his arm trapped inside the "circle" of your legs while you're fighting to get the legs hook and crossed properly. You may have to grab your shin to do this. (In fact, I just learned a great triangle that uses a shin grip as part of the setup, and ends with your forearm being part of the choke against his neck.)

    This is the easiest (and best) triangle setup I know so far. You can do this while he's still on his knees, or when he's standing.

    Here's great footage of someone using a similiar setup to get a triangle from spider guard:

    http://www.grapplearts.com/Elliott-at-NAGA.htm

    You'll start seeing triangles all over the place from spider guard when you make you goal putting on arm in and one arm out.
    Last edited by Aesopian; 10/25/2004 1:31pm at .
  2. WhiteShark is offline
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    1% Shark is better than you.

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    Posted On:
    10/25/2004 3:18pm

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     Style: BJJ/Shidokan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Interesting clip, is his body angled off at the "ideal" direction?

    Also what do you guys do when the uke blocks the triangle by bending the arm inside and posting it on your pants or their shoulder?
  3. Ronin is offline

    Merry Christmas Bitch

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    Posted On:
    10/25/2004 3:36pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Canadian Shidokan

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hit him in the face.
  4. Aesopian is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/25/2004 3:42pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    His angle was good in that clip. His hooking leg was cutting across the neck cleanly, not on the guys shoulder or back. He did a good job of getting his body horizontal to the guy despite a bunch of frantic movement by the endangered party.

    The analogy given in The Triangle by Rigan Machado (which I have reviewed like 5 times in different threads. Just go buy it on budovideos.com now.) is that you want your hooking leg to come down on their neck like you were try to cut their head off without touching their shoulders or back at all. The tip most people give is to try to get far enough to his side to look in his ear, which is good advice, though many will say you don't need to get that far over for the choke to work, but it's a good goal to have in mind.

    Some other points on finishing the triangle:

    Pull down on the head.
    Pull the knees together.
    Thrust the hips (or as someone on Sherdog so eliquently put it, "**** the chin!").

    Just locking the legs won't do it. You need to get pressure coming in from every direction available, and those are some of the main ones I can think of.
  5. Aesopian is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/25/2004 3:44pm

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark
    Interesting clip, is his body angled off at the "ideal" direction?

    Also what do you guys do when the uke blocks the triangle by bending the arm inside and posting it on your pants or their shoulder?
    My guess is to pull his elbow sideways so his arm bends. I'll check it out tonight and report.
  6. WhiteShark is offline
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    1% Shark is better than you.

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    Posted On:
    10/25/2004 3:58pm

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     Style: BJJ/Shidokan

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Basically their elbow keeps you from getting your hips close and they can hold the position by grabbing your pants or their Gi.
  7. Aesopian is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/25/2004 4:07pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Oops, I read you wrong the first time. I'll check that out tonight. I have class in like an hour.
  8. mikus is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/26/2004 12:47am


     Style: judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark
    I put my head on the floor to base and protect myself during a pass. (i never really do that and consider it "advanced")
    Could you explain this more? I don't know of it.

    Also, explain the counter more. Are you able to cross your legs behind their neck when they're in this position (but you're simply not able to adjust and fully triangle your legs) or does their arm position keep you from getting one arm in and one arm out AT ALL?
    You want some birth control? You can smoke a cigarette.
  9. Te No Kage! is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/26/2004 5:38am

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     Style: BJJ/Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark
    Basically their elbow keeps you from getting your hips close and they can hold the position by grabbing your pants or their Gi.
    here's my white belt opinion......

    when we were at the throwdown in Marietta in July, Bull Shaw was showing us his triangle and like Aesopian said "F=== the chin". IOW jam up your hips and crotch into his armpit past the elbow. Also, are you getting perpendicular? This always really helps me. Another thing I will do is actually pull on the arm to get that good tight fit, while some guys go ahead and pull down on the head. But I would definitely try getting perpendicular, trying to get my hips up and close and pull the arm through.
    "Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration." -A. Lincoln

    Vote your conscience.... Vote Libertarian!
  10. WhiteShark is offline
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    1% Shark is better than you.

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    Posted On:
    10/26/2004 8:05am

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     Style: BJJ/Shidokan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Mikus- The head on floor thing probably shouldn't be in this thread I was talking about a guard pass not a move FROM guard....

    TNK- Yeah those are all the basic things I am thinking about. I know I often don't get perpendicular enough but this problem is pretty specific and it keeps me from doin the things I should.

    Let me describe it again: The person in the triangle uses their trapped arm to protect their neck by digging their elbow into your(the chokers) low abdomen and securing the postion by holding onto your pants near the knee. Visually the person blocking should have their inside arm bent at the elbow and their hand should be touching their opposite shoulder.

    So my question is how do I break down this position or what do I need to be doing to keep them from getting here?
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