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  1. Fa Jing is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/12/2004 7:50pm


     Style: Brazilian JiuJitsu, Wing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    is this JKD?

    The Pan Nam system of Wing Chun is a different branch from the popular Hong Kong system.It has been called this way after the late Master Pan Nam, who took Sifu Eddie Chong as his last disciple in 1991.

    The Shaolin Temple monk, Yi Chum, was said by Pan Nam to be the true founder of Wing Chun. Yi Chum taught Tan Sau Ng, who taught Dai Fa Min Kam, Wong Wah Bo and Leung Yee Tei (Leung Jan's teachers) and so on until Pan Nam (see lineage chart here).
    Nevertheless, Pan Nam's account involving Tan Sau Ng fills in many gaps in the previously known history of Wing Chun, as it's recognized by several Wing Chun masters nowadays..This story regarding the origin of Wing Chun and the theories of this branch can seem to be in conflict with those of various other Wing Chun systems, but this is not really a problem when understood and considered objectively. Though at first glance some of the differences are dramatic, each system in fact complements the other, and knowledge of the theories and techniques of the Wing Chun taught by Master Pan can only improve one's martial skills. Understanding the differences and the reasons for any changes that have occured, gives us perhaps our only glimpse into the martial minds of the early masters.

    As for the differences, this branch of the Wing Chun family tree has not only preserved a different, possibly older, form of Wing Chun but also the Qigong (Chi-Kung) exercises that Master Pan said have been a part of the WIng Chun System from its inception. The techniques in Pan Nam Wing Chun are relaxed until the moment of initiating the attack. The stance uses a 50/50 weight distribution. The toes are pointed straight forward and advances are made with stepping movements as opposed to dragging the rear leg. The system emphasizes triangular footwork, as compared to linear directions. The punches can be directed towards any line from the shoulder. In other words, the shoulders are considered the centerline

    In Chi-Sao, the hands do not roll; they are in contact with each other a bit similar to the way the Tai Chi Push-Hands exercise is performed. There are three empty hand forms in the Pan Nam system: Siu Nim Tao, Chum Kiu and Biu Jee (although these are different from those found in the Yip Man system). These forms are conducted in a slow, deliberate manner that contributes to the development of Qi. Another feature of Pan Nam system is that hand movements feature grabbing or holding techniques characteristic of the eagle claw. The result of the hand movements is the control of the opponent.

    In Pan Nam Wing Chun, the emphasis is upon a sudden move that controls the opponent, disrupts the opponent's stance, and forceful strikes to vital points. Consequently, there's no extended rolling of the hands.
    As for the differences, this branch of the Wing Chun family tree has not only preserved a different, possibly older, form of Wing Chun but also the Qigong (Chi-Kung) exercises that Master Pan said have been a part of the WIng Chun System from its inception. The techniques in Pan Nam Wing Chun are relaxed until the moment of initiating the attack. The stance uses a 50/50 weight distribution. The toes are pointed straight forward and advances are made with stepping movements as opposed to dragging the rear leg. The system emphasizes triangular footwork, as compared to linear directions. The punches can be directed towards any line from the shoulder. In other words, the shoulders are considered the centerline.

    The emphasis in Pan Nam style upon footwork and rotational force results in "soft" hands that do not telegraph one's intent. The concept of bridging the gap is accomplished through the footwork. The arm movements along the centerline instill, in the beginner, the essence of economy of motion. That is, the straightest line is the fastest and most economical motion for a beginner. The movement along the centerline has defensive advantages including intercepting an opponent's attack. During the advancement of skill level, the concept of centerline develops a more complex meaning. In the Pan Nam system, the basics are, as mentioned before, to (1) control the opponent, (2) redirection of the opponent's centerline and (3) disruption of the opponents stance. At that point in time, one can attack with minimal risk of counter-attack.
    In other words, as one develops skill, one is less concerned with the specific technique of an opponent. Rather than thinking of one's own centerline, the re-direction of the opponent's centerline is the key to successful attack. At that point, one's attack can occur from any direction of one's shoulder. Logically and physically, there are many advantages through striking from any angle (as opposed to the centerline only). The concept of interception is a basic element. In its simplest terms, the idea of intercept prevents the opponent from placing one in a position of defeat - trapping, pinning, stance disruption, etc. The principle of intercept is to redirect the opponent's movements before the opponent can complete a move, offensively or defensively.

    This redirection of the opponent's energy is conducted through (1) sensitivity, (2) "going with the flow" of the opponent's movement (as distinguished from "giving in"), and (3) proper contact with the opponent's arm or leg. Without the concept of intercept, one is reliant upon either eye-and-hand coordination (which may be deficient to superior reach or speed) or simply a contest of brute force (which may be deficient to superior strength). "Forward energy" is an integral element to the principle of intercept.

    Take from Eddie Chongs site

    www.wingchunbakmei.com


    is this JKD? Sounds alot like it to me.

    Opinons?
  2. meowrsx is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/12/2004 7:58pm


     Style: JKDC

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Once again, confusing jun fan with JKD. refer to osiris' sig for details on that. And I'm gonna go out on a wing here and say that a kung fu known as Pan Nam is not the equivalent of MMA.
  3. JKDChick is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/12/2004 8:00pm

    staff
     Style: JKD, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It's Wing Chun, an integral art in JKDC, yes, but no -- no one system is JKD.
    Monkey Ninjas! Attack!
  4. Fa Jing is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/12/2004 8:03pm


     Style: Brazilian JiuJitsu, Wing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    so is JKD another word for MMA?
  5. WTDude is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/12/2004 8:35pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    This description is basically identical to Wing Tsun or Wing Tzun, except for your inferior footwork.
  6. Fa Jing is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/12/2004 9:50pm


     Style: Brazilian JiuJitsu, Wing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    who is your sifu WT?

    FYI Chong isnt my sifu, nor do i train exclusively in his style.
  7. meowrsx is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2004 12:21am


     Style: JKDC

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I like to think of JKD as MMA. Some people might disagree, but essentially that's what happens when you "take what is useful and discard the rest." We'll learn Wing Chun stuff, we'll learn muay thai stuff, bjj stuff, and all that crap. Then YOU choose what techniques you like, and use them in sparring. They won't tell you "use the jun fan entry because it's better." If just flying in with a bunch of boxing punches actually works for you, then do it.
  8. iamamonster is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2004 4:11am


     Style: judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Originally posted by meowrsx
    They won't tell you "use the jun fan entry because it's better." If just flying in with a bunch of boxing punches actually works for you, then do it.
    Wow, thats so Tao...
  9. SLJ is offline

    Titan

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2004 5:01am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm JKD
    "You realise the transformations give a man enough strength to destroy a truck with his bare hands!?
    YOU HAVE BETRAYED ME, IN THE WORST POSSIBLE MANNER!!" - KiWarrior

    "Sport ? That kind of thing's not my bag baby!" - Sammy Franco

    "This system was developed with the help of notible BJJ fighter Ribbon Muchado." - "Sifu" Anthony Iglesias
  10. Te(V)plar is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2004 5:22am


     Style: BJJ/MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Rickson by armbar.
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