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  1. 9chambers

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2004 3:40pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ronin,

    >You MUST include squats and deadlifts

    I'm still not sure how I feel about squats. Good mornings and squats are responsible for more injuries than any other weight training exercises. Maybe bad form is responsible for most of that but it is easy for guys to say that. Nobody wants to blame the exercise, just the guy. I don't know, to me it seems like maybe it's the exercise because these guys getting injured aren't begginers and it really doesn't look like an exercise that is that complicated. Also, so much weight is involved. I really don't see myself ever needing to lift 300 pounds on my back for any reason. I am reading up on squats but I am still kind of unsure anout them. I don't want to get into them until I know for sure my knees and back will not suffer.

    As for the bench press, it is one of the best. I eliminated it to cut down on time. I just figured if I am doing the overhead press, pull-ups and rows then why do the bench press.. is that wrong? The overhead press is pretty much the military press really. Should I eliminate the overhead press instead?

    >and crunches are NO exception.

    If you add weight to crunches, won't your abs be too big? I mean, aren't abs supposed to be compact so you can bend easily? If you have huge abs then how is that different than having a gut? I'm not trying to be smart, I'm seriously asking. My feeling is that abs need to be more tight and compact than big. Am I wrong on this?

    >high inensity is NOT as good a fat burner
    >than keeping a moderate steady pace.

    What exercise is best for that? Stairmaster? Exercise bike? Shadow boxing (as opposed to Taebo)? What do you recommend? Sparring would be best, of course. I really don't have guys to spar with very often right now since I am not part of a dojo. I have to invite old friends over. They aren't readily available more than once a week. Soon, I will join this great JKD/BJJ dojo downtown and I'll have more opportunities to be involved in sparring again.

    >As for the running and sprintining,
    >you seem to like and enjoy it,
    >so do it.

    It is important to have a good time, I guess. Right now I don't get to play ball with the guys or anything like that very much but I still want to run.

    monkey,

    >hang on to the chin up bar,
    >bring your knees in and then kick out.

    How many reps do you think is good? What do I need to remember when doing this exercise? It sounds pretty cool. I've done this, sort of .. just tucking my knees to my chest and going back down. I've also done that Kung Fu exercise where you jump up, touch your knees to your chest and land on your feet. That one is high impact so I am not sure the benefits outweigh the bad. As for the hanging one, I found that I tend to swing and do them fast so it really isn't worth it. If I were to extend my legs like you said, that might work really well.

    >raccoon pull-ups

    Raccoon pull-ups are for your lats and triceps more than your biceps and shoulders. What you do is, find a pole or chin up bar, wrap your hands around opposite sides, like a baseball bat, and hang there. Only, don't put your thumbs around the bar, keep your thumbs on the same side as your fingers. You can put one hand over the other, that's fine. Then you pull head up on one side of the pole, drop back down, pull your head up on the other side of the pole, drop down. These don't seem as hard as regular pull-ups because you have more leverage and more muscles are involved. That's why you can do more of them than regular pull-ups. I like these. If you don't then that is fine. I think they are more realistic than regular pull-ups. Nobody climbs with their arms unless they are doing it for fitness. People climbs with their lats. You toss an arm up there and pull with your shoulder and back in addition to your arms. I was the king of the monkey bars when I was little and I've always liked climbing so I like this exercise.

    jubei33,

    >that machine where your legs hang
    >down and you have to pull them up
    >using your lower abs.

    I have to train at home because I can't afford a gym right now. I guess I could rig something up. I could put a plank of wood down, leaning it on the back steps or the couch. Interesting..

    >nothing else except maybe add more sparing..

    I can't right now. I don't have the money to join that BJJ school yet. My sparring is pretty much limited to when my friends can come over and workout right now. We do it now and then.
    Last edited by 9chambers; 6/08/2004 3:53pm at .
  2. Ronin is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2004 3:47pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Shi Ja Quan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The biggest danger of squats is TOO much weight TOO Fast, just be careful and use the squat rack.
    And to parallel is just fine, no need to full squat unless you can do so EASILY.
    You ab muscles are like any other, they will get "bigger" as YOU GET BIGGER, but to a far more lilimted degree, based on your genetics.
    There is NO such thing as "tight abs", just like "tight biceps" or "tight traps", they are a muscle like any other, treat them as such.
    ANY moderate activity you like, stair/bike/tread, its all good, just keep the constant pace, hard enought that you are sweating BUT not so hard that you can't breath, if you can talk but with a bit of effort, that is fine.
  3. WhiteShark is offline
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    1% Shark is better than you.

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2004 4:01pm

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: BJJ/Shidokan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Talking but not singing is my favorite intensity gauge for cardio.
  4. 9chambers

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2004 4:11pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    >no need to full squat

    I'll try them out for a week or two and see if I like them. I'll keep the weight low and just see how it feels. If a disk doesn't fly out of my back or anything I'll keep working on them. I don't know though. It seems like pro athletes do them a lot and they are all okay but every time I hear about somebody getting injured weight liftin, this is what did it. I guess it's just because they do too much weight. Are squats really necessary though?
    Last edited by 9chambers; 6/08/2004 7:36pm at .
  5. Ronin is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/09/2004 7:25am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Shi Ja Quan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    No exercise is "really nescessary", but squats are VERY benefitial to your overall musculature.
    They hit ALL of your body.
    If you prefer lighter weight, i would suggest the infamous 20 rep squat routine:
    You get a weight that you can only do for 12-15 reps MAX, then you keep doing it till you hit 20, its an awesome cardio routine, you will be huffing and puffing and your legs will BURN !!
    Because you are using a "lighter" weight, you will not be under so much "stress".
    If you have concerns about your back. stop at when you feel your back "arching" or "tipping forward", that is usually at or just below parallel for most.
    Again, if you start of light and work your way SLOWLY, you will be fine, remember, a squat is a VERY NATURAL motion, your sitting down in a "chair", so there is no reason NOT to do them.
    Unless, you have some physical problem.
    The best exercises are those that are natural and that will be "movements" you do in everyday life:
    Squat - sitting down
    Deadlift - lifting something heavy or pushing a stalled car
    Dips - pushing our bodies out of a armed chair
    Chin ups - lifting out bodies when we climp a ladder or a rope
    Bench press - getting off our lady after some serious hump time :)
  6. Hannibal is offline

    Grandmaster Sensei of Village Idiocy

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    Posted On:
    6/09/2004 7:52am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kyokushin and Judo.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yeah 9 chambers thats alot. In fact I think its too much. Your not a proffesional athlete and you do have a job right ?

    I still stand by my advice. Just do martial arts training 3 times per week and weights at the gym once or twice per week depending how much energy you have.

    Sprints and weights are all very fine but do they make you a better martial artst ? No.
    Hannibal: The sworn enemy of dishonest politicians, source of entertainment on Bullshido and newly appointed Office Linebacker. Terry Tait ain't got **** on me !!!!
  7. lost future is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/09/2004 8:23am


     Style: Budokai, judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Originally posted by Hannibal
    Sprints and weights are all very fine but do they make you a better martial artst ? No.
    If done correctly, yes they do
  8. 9chambers

    Guest

    Posted On:
    6/09/2004 12:17pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ronin,

    I will try out squats. It does seem like a natural motion .. even though I never get out of a chair with a dude on my shoulders I can see the benefit. You could carry someone to safety like a fireman or soldier. He may weigh 300 pounds. Also, it could help with throws. The deadlift seems pretty natural too. I was thinking yesterday, maybe walking up stairs with some weight could be benefitial but that is just a complication that could be unsafe, squats would be more natural. Hmh. ... Thanks for the advice.

    Hannibal,

    Sprinting works your whole body, much like swimming. It works your legs, your abs, your lower back, your shoulders and your arms. I see it as one of the most primary elements of human motion. Most athletes run. In war, soldiers run from place to place. In our lives, running is something we do a lot if we are active in sports or recreation. It is also fundamental to my particular style of combat. I like to throw crosses and rear leg kicks and this motion is very similar to those. It works all of the muscles in the very same way that I use them. Actually, some of my stances look like a running stride. I think it is much more similar to my style than swimming, climbing or weight training.

    Also, it is hard work. Sprinting is violent, much like martial arts. It isn't a slow and calculated motion. I think you get better conditioning during sprinting than you can doing kata, kick paces, simple combonations or drills. Only sparring at full intensity or wrestling work your body that hard. It stretches you out and builds your stamina as well as your strength. I think it is valuable.

    I'm really not up to this schedule yet. I hope to be by the end of summer. I may cut some things off the list. The focus days are only once every month or so, as a substitute for a cardio day - just to promote variation. The stretch day is just an easy workout on Sundays. The others I am doing during the week and they take about an hour or two. That is as much time as most people spend watching TV so it's no big deal. If I miss a day here and there, no big deal. It's not regimented. It's not something I have to do. Just something fun.

    Honestly, at this point in my life I am thinking more about my health and fitness than my fighting prowess. I want my cholesterol down and I want to be able to get around when I am old. This schedule may end up being cut down a bit but it is my goal for summer. I am doing about half this much work right now. Like, for sprints I get to the 50 yard dashes then the hundred and I am finished for now. Then I do the crunches. I hope to be able to do the whole thing by the end of July.

    My martial arts workout right now doesn't work me hard enough. I want to be in better shape. Even at the BJJ/JKD school I am joining, their program is only an hour or two and two times a week. That's not enough work to consider myself athletic. I think I have enough experience in martial arts that all I am doing with that is maintaining it and gaining a few additional skills. I don't have to practice non-stop to do that. Keeping up my body's ability to do the work is important though. ..... In class they stop to teach and you stand around listening and there are drills and you barely even sweat except during sparring. When I am sprinting I sweat from the time I start until I hit the showers. It's a much harder workout. I love martial arts but I need more than what I can get in the dojo in terms of fitness.

    This is what my sprint workout looks like this week:

    > CARDIO 1 - sprints

    bikeride 1 mile (warm up)
    25 yard dash 1x15
    50 yard dash 1x10
    100 yard dash 1x1
    bikeride 1 mile (cool down)
    crunches 1x200 (hold each for 1-2 sec)
    major stretches

    - Oh yea, I was trying out holding each crunch for 5 seconds and that was just kind of overkill. I was trying to work in some isometrics that way but it doesn't really seem to make a difference other than taking up more time. I cut them back down to about one second.
    Last edited by 9chambers; 6/09/2004 12:32pm at .
  9. jubei33 is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/09/2004 8:14pm


     Style: Boxing, Solar Ray Attack

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    this is the contraption I was talking about. I made one in my garage with some 2X4s for dips and abb training.
    http://woodwardswhiskey.wordpress.com/

    He was punching him like the collective karmic debt he'd accrued was coming to collections, mostly on his face.
  10. jubei33 is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/09/2004 8:16pm


     Style: Boxing, Solar Ray Attack

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ok nevermind..just search for abdominal cradle
    http://woodwardswhiskey.wordpress.com/

    He was punching him like the collective karmic debt he'd accrued was coming to collections, mostly on his face.
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