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  1. #11
    Wounded Ronin's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have clicked through to an article by Wayne LaPierre on 1st Freedom and frankly it disturbs me. It is like he is trying to incite NRA members to hate anyone who doesn't blindly support Donald Trump. I feel very concerned about the content of this article, as well as the baldly stated falsehoods, such as the idea that the investigations against Trump have no merit whatsoever, or that the 2nd Amendment is somehow equivalent to economic issues (see his allusion to class warfare). Or even the statement that Obama engineered a "planned decline" of the United States, whatever that means.

    There is so much irony in his accusing others of "blind anger".

    https://www.americas1stfreedom.org/a..._campaign=0817

    For the older members of our political family, none have seen anything like the mass hatred leveled at a sitting president. Hatred isn’t strong enough. It is coldly staged, organized rage. It’s everywhere in a willing media, and it’s leveled against what should be the normal, peaceful change in government. It is manufactured rage against the good Americans who voted for a change of direction for our nation.

    In all of this, the media rage-machine is promoting talk of impeachment—on nothing but blind anger.

    But the rage is not just against a good, duly elected president, Donald Trump; it is against his promise of a better nation. The rage is against all Americans who want to end the planned decline of the United States, orchestrated by eight years of Barack Obama and his political machine.

    The elite rage is against you, me, our families, friends and co-workers who believe in Trump’s campaign slogan, “Make America Great Again.” The rage is against Trump succeeding and keeping his promises.

    Those who are orchestrating this relentless campaign are the keepers of the swamp.

    This is a class hatred most Americans in modern times have never witnessed.

    I say most Americans, because as NRA members, we are used to the bigoted hostility of the media and the enemies of freedom. We have borne the brunt of it since NRA emerged as the most potent lobbying force in the nation.

    This year, we are celebrating the 40th anniversary of what has come to be known as the “Cincinnati Revolution”—the unique and proud moment in the history of the association when members rose up in a spontaneous movement and took back their NRA from internal players who were hell-bent on abandoning the defense of the right to keep and bear arms, which they found embarrassing.

    But the revolution, which made possible the power and status of the NRA today, began two years earlier, in 1975, when a handful of leaders—including then Congressman John Dingell and just-past NRA President Allan Cors, among others—convinced the Board of Directors to create a separate, independent lobbying arm—the NRA Institute for Legislative Action (ILA). It was a far-sighted move that the members demanded.

    The Institute was staffed by young, diverse and—above all—totally dedicated men and women who worked tirelessly to forever change the political landscape of our nation. For all of these men and women, losing was not in their vocabulary.

    These remarkable pioneers understood the collective power of NRA members. Under the astute leadership of former NRA President Harlon B. Carter, almost overnight ILA established itself as a force to be reckoned with. In its first year of existence, ILA won battles on Capitol Hill never thought possible.

    But as ILA succeeded beyond expectations, forces within the NRA were organizing an internal coup intended to abandon and destroy this new lobby and move the NRA in a whole new direction. Literally these forces within the hierarchy and on the Board wanted to move the NRA away from saving the Second Amendment into policy areas to curry the respect of the Second Amendment-denying media.

    Their scheme to turn away from the Second Amendment was doomed by the rank-and-file members of the NRA through a spontaneous reaction that came to a head at the members meeting in Cincinnati in 1977. During an all-night session of the Annual Meeting of Members, ILA was saved and the NRA was put on a permanent path with a single goal—preserving the liberty uniquely reserved to individual Americans. It was a birthright moment, and it indeed changed the course of American history.

    That outcome at Cincinnati—the total dedication of NRA as the oldest civil rights organization in the nation—was a forceful transition into the NRA we know today.

    That solidarity was met with a new and more hateful reaction by the media. From then through today, the media has referred to Cincinnati as a takeover by “radicals.” What is radical about being dedicated to the preservation of the Bill of Rights for all peaceable Americans? If that is radical, then we all should embrace the word.

    Cincinnati was not the takeover of the NRA by “crazies,” it was a reaffirmation of our role in preserving American liberty—the will of the members.

    And that gets back to the venom of the media and of the political elites against the transition of power and the election of President Trump.

    In the watershed 2016 election, Trump and his majorities in both houses of Congress have a mandate: Put the nation back on track.

    The election was about returning to what President Abraham Lincoln described as the vision of the founders—a government “of the people, by the people, for the people.”

    For the eight years of Barack Obama’s “fundamental transformation,” it had become his government “of the elites, by the elites and for the elites.”

    What we are seeing in the deluge of hatred and bigotry against the remarkable change in the direction of our nation—against the will of a beleaguered people—is the elites gone rabid.

    Trump has sworn to make our nation great again, and the elites can’t allow that to happen.

    Hence we are beginning to hear talk of “impeachment.” It’s growing in the media. It’s crazy.

    But it can’t happen unless the likes of Sen. Chuck Schumer, D-N.Y., and Sen. Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., and their media cheerleaders succeed in winning majorities in the coming 2018 mid-term congressional elections. Removing Trump will be their single evil election issue. Bank on it.

    But just as NRA members were a major factor in electing the most pro-Second Amendment president since Ronald Reagan, and a Congress to back him, we must work hard to maintain our majorities in the U.S. Senate and the U.S. House of Representatives. And we must protect our gains in state legislatures and governorships.

    We must organize. We must overcome the unending false attacks against all things Trump so that the elites will not have a chance to attain their ultimate goal: to make America theirs again!
    Last edited by Wounded Ronin; 8/02/2017 10:08am at .
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  2. #12
    3moose1's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    So I'm former military, current law student, and I'm an NRA-certified law enforcement handgun and shotgun instructor. (The LE instructor courses are much different than the regular, nonsense instructor courses they hold).

    The only reason I'm a member of the NRA is because my credentials require it. Personally, I can't stand them. Their legislative agenda is eclectic, and ostensibly looks out more for gun manufacturers than individual gun owners. This ad is ridiculous, and it makes me ashamed to even associate with the NRA.

    Their pushing the GOP party line of "zomg ur so in dangerz". It's ridiculous - violent crime is declining, and has been declining for decades! Pushing this ridiculous, divisive rhetoric accomplishes nothing. Motherfuckers need to realize that people can differ on opinion. That's fine. It's okay. The world will not fucking end.

    Goddamn.

    PROOF that I'm not a completely useless poster:
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  3. #13
    BackFistMonkey's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Based on the Right Wing violence against the rest of America this past weekend, and the people involved retweeting tweets, posting videos and using slogans from the NRA recent campaigns. I can't help but wonder if everyone has the same blase feelings about this approach of the NRA Marketing violence against Americans and that maybe it is just a little more than a little bit irresponsible.
    Quote Originally Posted by ghost55 View Post
    Violence is pretty uncommon in clubs in this area, and the dude didn't seem particularly hostile up until the moment he slapped me.
    “I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.”
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    Quote Originally Posted by WFMurphyPhD View Post
    Slamming the man in the bottom position from time to time keeps everybody on their toes and discourages butt scooting stupidity.

  4. #14
    Cassius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BackFistMonkey View Post
    Based on the Right Wing violence against the rest of America this past weekend, and the people involved retweeting tweets, posting videos and using slogans from the NRA recent campaigns. I can't help but wonder if everyone has the same blase feelings about this approach of the NRA Marketing violence against Americans and that maybe it is just a little more than a little bit irresponsible.
    You're going to need to clarify your hypothesis a bit.
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal

  5. #15
    BackFistMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cassius View Post
    You're going to need to clarify your hypothesis a bit.
    Yeah I am having a hard time getting my thoughts written clearly.

    Many of the White Nationalist/Alt Right/White Supremacists/Nazi/KKK protesters which have been dehooded since this past weekend's events have been found promoting this video and tweets I started this thread with.

    This includes the Domestic Terrorist driving the car which injured 19 people and killed one and led to the death of two Officers in a helicopter crash. Some of the men who were beating the black boy in the parking garage next to police station have been dehooded as well as one of the 3% who was standing guard with a long gun at the ready keeping away anyone attempting to help. They too were posting and promoting the NRA's ideas that violence is the answer when the news shows your faults and tells you things you don't like about yourself, the country you live in, and the leader you voted in to lead the country as whole.

    I was wondering if anyone's easy acceptance of the NRA's creation of division and promotion of violence against fellow Americans had changed any. Or if anyone else has noticed a connection between the NRA and the current emboldening of racist **** bags and white first isolationists.
    Quote Originally Posted by ghost55 View Post
    Violence is pretty uncommon in clubs in this area, and the dude didn't seem particularly hostile up until the moment he slapped me.
    “I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.”
    BILL HICKS,
    1961-1994

    Quote Originally Posted by WFMurphyPhD View Post
    Slamming the man in the bottom position from time to time keeps everybody on their toes and discourages butt scooting stupidity.

  6. #16
    Cassius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BackFistMonkey View Post
    Yeah I am having a hard time getting my thoughts written clearly.

    Many of the White Nationalist/Alt Right/White Supremacists/Nazi/KKK protesters which have been dehooded since this past weekend's events have been found promoting this video and tweets I started this thread with.

    This includes the Domestic Terrorist driving the car which injured 19 people and killed one and led to the death of two Officers in a helicopter crash. Some of the men who were beating the black boy in the parking garage next to police station have been dehooded as well as one of the 3% who was standing guard with a long gun at the ready keeping away anyone attempting to help. They too were posting and promoting the NRA's ideas that violence is the answer when the news shows your faults and tells you things you don't like about yourself, the country you live in, and the leader you voted in to lead the country as whole.

    I was wondering if anyone's easy acceptance of the NRA's creation of division and promotion of violence against fellow Americans had changed any. Or if anyone else has noticed a connection between the NRA and the current emboldening of racist **** bags and white first isolationists.
    For my part, my feelings are conflicted. It's shortsighted rhetoric doesn't help much with the long game, but it does a good job these days of stifling gun control efforts. I'd be happy to support a less terrible alternative to more gun control. Well I am not a member, so support is a strong word.

    As to whether I think the Dana Loesch crazy train is actually inciting violence? I'm not sure what isn't a flash point anymore these days. Everyone is so fucking mad at each other. Here I am in arguably the happiest days of my life, the most at peace I've ever been, and our country (or at least social media and a ton of people with nothing better to do) is full of people on both sides who have started to believe that folk on the other don't have the right to the oxygen in their lungs.

    I'm really not sure where I stand. I don't really want to pay a $200 tax on gun mufflers or slightly shorter long guns anymore, but I don't think hot rhetoric about liberals being the enemy really does anyone any long term good. The rub is, I'm really not sure the right started this one. But hey, Israel and Palestine are doing well right now, so I am sure that we will follow their example and work everything out.
    Last edited by Cassius; 8/15/2017 9:15pm at . Reason: Accidentally wrote is instead of isn't
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal

  7. #17
    Wounded Ronin's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cassius View Post
    For my part, my feelings are conflicted. It's shortsighted rhetoric doesn't help much with the long game, but it does a good job these days of stifling gun control efforts. I'd be happy to support a less terrible alternative to more gun control. Well I am not a member, so support is a strong word.

    As to whether I think the Dana Loesch crazy train is actually inciting violence? I'm not sure what isn't a flash point anymore these days. Everyone is so fucking mad at each other. Here I am in arguably the happiest days of my life, the most at peace I've ever been, and our country (or at least social media and a ton of people with nothing better to do) is full of people on both sides who have started to believe that folk on the other don't have the right to the oxygen in their lungs.

    I'm really not sure where I stand. I don't really want to pay a $200 tax on gun mufflers or slightly shorter long guns anymore, but I don't think hot rhetoric about liberals being the enemy really does anyone any long term good. The rub is, I'm really not sure the right started this one. But hey, Israel and Palestine are doing well right now, so I am sure that we will follow their example and work everything out.
    The solution is to drop the identity politics (sacrificing long term 2A rights to demographic changes in exchange for votes now) and simply take "liberals" shooting so they can opine from facts and direct experiences, and not from the basis of divisive politics.

    Right now guns are an abstract tribal issue for those who have not grown up using them. People are dogmatic and irrational on tribal issues. I would also argue that as destructive as modern small arms can be in skilled hands, many "liberals" actually misunderstand their limitations simply because they have no knowledge or experience in the shooting disciplines. They don't fully understand what firearms can and cannot do. The only solution is to make it concrete and pedestrian through practical hands-on training. Only then can there be a rational discussion.

    In closing, consider some of the faculty opinions on concealed carry on campus. Notice how they don't demonstrate any knowledge of culture of firearms safety or any nuts and bolts understanding of professional concealed carry. Instead, per the statements, the gun is an abstract force that stops the free exchange of ideas. It's almost like an ideological miasma instead of being a simple mechanical device of early 20th century technology.

    From https://www.insidehighered.com/news/...om-fewer-would

    Preliminary research being presented today at the annual meeting of the American Educational Research Association gives new insight into what share of professors feel intellectually limited by the specter of guns in their classrooms or would adjust their teaching styles if they had to teach under campus carry.

    Some three-quarters (70 percent) of respondents disagreed or strongly disagreed with the statement “I support the right of license holders to carry concealed weapons on campus.” A similar number (71 percent) agreed or strongly agreed that campus carry laws “will have a negative impact on the free and robust exchange of ideas at the my university.”

    While there was overwhelming antipathy for campus carry and concern about how it might affect academic freedom institution-wide, responses to questions about how individual professors might alter their own teaching practices were more varied.

    Over half of the sample (53 percent) said their approaches to teaching controversial or emotionally charged topics would most likely or definitely stay the same, for example. Thirty-one percent said their practices would most likely or definitely not stay the same, while 15 percent of professors were unsure.

    In response to the statement “I expect to omit some topic(s) from my course content,” 58 percent of respondents said they would most likely or definitely not do so. Eighteen percent were unsure, and 23 percent said they probably would omit some topics.

    Asked whether they planned to “tone down” their usual approaches to teaching controversial or sensitive topics, 46 percent said they probably would not, while 40 percent said they probably would. The rest were unsure.

    Over all, 50 percent said their “ability to effectively teach controversial or emotionally charged topics will be negatively impacted,” while 30 percent said it most likely or definitely would not.

    ....

    One could, for example, "be scared stiff of students carrying, and yet on principle refuse to change ones practice in interacting with students," he said. "From my point of view, the advent of campus carry has changed my perceptions of interactions with students, particularly one-on-one in charged situations," such as negative discussions about grades. Snow said his office hours are now by appointment only, for example.

    I feel like the respondents are missing something, which is cultural competency in this case. If they had firsthand knowledge of firearms safety culture, they would know there are strong cultural (besides for legal) inhibitions against presenting the firearm or muzzling someone over something like a classroom discussion. They're missing a piece of the puzzle and for right now are inserting sensationalist news stories to form their mental narrative.
    Best Vietnam War music video I've ever seen put together by a vet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDY8raKsdfg

  8. #18
    Diesel_tke's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    All we would need to fix all of this is for people to boycott the news and social media for a month. I tend to take the weekends off from the news and most social media because I'm usually out doing stuff like camping, boating, or drinking at the river. When I'm out and about, I don't see all of this conflict that everyone is freaking out about. When I talk to people around town (black, white, or otherwise), people are nice and generally helpful with things.

    But yeah, when people find this video useful for their narrative, they repost it. They're assholes.
    Combatives training log.

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  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by DCS View Post
    I can hear Devil fapping from here.
    If you look closely, you can see gouts of flame over the horizon.

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