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  1. blackmonk is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/05/2014 8:02pm

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     Style: belt and jacket wrestling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What I do know is that I'm starting to feel that circular kuzushi pull where you draw uke behind you, and onto your hip... Lots of good players I know do that with uchi mata. It's how I have been getting osoto gari and osoto makikomi so much lately, also.

    At least 50% percent of those o goshi are coming like that, more or less, along with more than a few of those Zantaraia belly-to-belly pickups that lead into a harai or o goshi.
  2. BKR is online now
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    Posted On:
    5/06/2014 1:50pm

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     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    What I do know is that I'm starting to feel that circular kuzushi pull where you draw uke behind you, and onto your hip... Lots of good players I know do that with uchi mata. It's how I have been getting osoto gari and osoto makikomi so much lately, also.

    At least 50% percent of those o goshi are coming like that, more or less, along with more than a few of those Zantaraia belly-to-belly pickups that lead into a harai or o goshi.
    That's very good. It takes a while to get the circular movement and timing down, once you do it has many, many applications.

    I did a short video last night after practice, however, I'm not sure it shows what I was trying to show regarding the "bending the back" stuff, which was kinda the point. In fact, I may be doing something different and have equated it "bending the back".

    What it does show is my spiffy new haircut and the fact that my uke does nice ukemi...
    Falling for Judo since 1980
  3. blackmonk is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/06/2014 1:55pm

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     Style: belt and jacket wrestling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Bending your own back, or uke's?
  4. judoka_uk is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/06/2014 3:50pm

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     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    "Bending back" is a CK-ism isn't it, which means it's probably a bit dodgy?

    What I think CK thought was "bending back" is actually chest contact, but he just hadn't sufficient exposure to real world Judo to realise it.

    In O Goshi making chest contact is as important as Uchi mata, which is why you see so many people failing at O goshi, because they bend over at the waist and get nowhere.

    Example Illiadis running through some of the main Koshi waza, note the chest contact from hip to armpit in every technique.

    At 4.30 onwards Illiadis makes the point about chest contact and how inserting the hip too far through loses chest contact and ruins the technique.

  5. BKR is online now
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    Posted On:
    5/06/2014 4:15pm

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     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    Bending your own back, or uke's?
    both, actually. Like I said, I'm re-evaluating what actually happens. The video I made wasn't very clear in terms of showing what I feel. In Uki Goshi, for example, the action I write of is pretty clear.

    See, we are both trying to figure things out.
    Falling for Judo since 1980
  6. BKR is online now
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    Posted On:
    5/06/2014 6:58pm

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     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Quote Originally Posted by judoka_uk View Post
    "Bending back" is a CK-ism isn't it, which means it's probably a bit dodgy?

    What I think CK thought was "bending back" is actually chest contact, but he just hadn't sufficient exposure to real world Judo to realise it.

    No, it was something that came up, if I recall, on Judo Forum, that we discussed. I think it originated during a discussion of Hane Goshi in which some video of an older Japanese judoka was demonstrating and explaining Hane Goshi.

    In O Goshi making chest contact is as important as Uchi mata, which is why you see so many people failing at O goshi, because they bend over at the waist and get nowhere.

    Example Illiadis running through some of the main Koshi waza, note the chest contact from hip to armpit in every technique.

    At 4.30 onwards Illiadis makes the point about chest contact and how inserting the hip too far through loses chest contact and ruins the technique.

    No, it was something that came up, if I recall, on Judo Forum, that was discussed ? I think it originated during a discussion of Hane Goshi in which some video of an older Japanese judoka was demonstrating and explaining Hane Goshi. CK may have made some sort of comments or expounded upon the idea, though.

    Bending the back doesn't mean sticking your hip in too far, which is of course a fault/mistake. I'm struggling to put into words... it's one way to fit into the chest to hip contact better. It's not necessary, I don't think, but is a useful, to me at least.

    It's more a way to get uke to lean/support his body on tori.
    Falling for Judo since 1980
  7. blackmonk is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/06/2014 9:41pm

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     Style: belt and jacket wrestling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!


    Not sure this is the best angle. I did this slowly to make sure I was being mindful of the mechanics.

    I've also seen the Iliadis video before. It has been very influential in my game over the last year-ish.
  8. BKR is online now
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    Posted On:
    5/07/2014 9:36am

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     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post


    Not sure this is the best angle. I did this slowly to make sure I was being mindful of the mechanics.

    I've also seen the Iliadis video before. It has been very influential in my game over the last year-ish.
    That looks better.

    You lost balance towards your right near the end, and your left hand/arm got loose as well, coming off of your chest, resulting in a small loss of control. Keep that tight across your chest so that when you rotate uke goes with you...any space and he can get away.

    Uke was supported on your body (the chest to hip contact) which is good. Try making your initial "step" a bit further in front of uke and see what happens.

    Your "free" leg was far to the left, which is a bit deeper than necessary, made a kind of hane goshi like action. I'd avoid doing that, it can be a bit of a crutch and can lead to your hip being too far across, and you basically stopped your rotation because of it.

    Once uke is loaded onto you, you won't be doing much lifting (as noted earlier by judoka_uk), but rotating. Stretch your and rotate, your leg will lift .
    Falling for Judo since 1980
  9. BKR is online now
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    Posted On:
    5/07/2014 10:03am

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     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post


    Not sure this is the best angle. I did this slowly to make sure I was being mindful of the mechanics.

    I've also seen the Iliadis video before. It has been very influential in my game over the last year-ish.
    Iliadis is awesome, like a force of nature.

    Turn your head and rotate your shoulders more when throwing as well.
    Falling for Judo since 1980
  10. judoratt is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/07/2014 10:22am


     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Try to move your attacking leg/foot 10 to 12 inches to your right and step deeper with your planting leg while leaving your attacking leg behind. The uchimata looks good!
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