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  1. Petrus_Carter is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/05/2014 5:14am


     Style: Krav Maga, Sambo, MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Fighting tall fatsos

    Hey guys, any recommendations for fighting tall fatsos. I 6ft, fit, and can fight quite well on my feet or in the ground.
    Still, those fatsos taller than me seem to be a staple around here and most of even think they're "mammas big boys" so it's impossible to get any decent training out of them. They just throw some lame punches before trying to grapple you and overwhelm you with their weight (their only advanget)
    My instruction recommended circling them and tiring them with face punches before bringing them down with kicks to the shins/knees/ankles.
    No grappling, no ground fighting with them.
    Any recomnendations?
  2. Plasma is online now
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    Bullshido's Greatest Ninja

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    Posted On:
    4/05/2014 9:42am

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     Style: JJJ/Judo[Nidan] BJJ[Blue]

    2
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Learn to fight in the Clinch and Grapple?
  3. Petrus_Carter is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/05/2014 1:30pm


     Style: Krav Maga, Sambo, MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Plasma View Post
    Learn to fight in the Clinch and Grapple?
    I've experience in bjj and can deal with my instructor pretty well (smaller than me but heavier and VERY strong). The thing is when the weight is just too much to beat on the ground.
  4. blackmonk is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/05/2014 3:17pm

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     Style: belt and jacket wrestling

    2
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Size and weight are a real-world advantage. Don't try to downplay that. Then you're just buying into the bullshit "everyone can do martial arts" marketing crap. The problem is real and obviously there, or you wouldn't be posting about it.

    I grapple fatties all the time. If they are better than you in technique, then improve your technique. If they are stronger than you, then lift some weights. They key to fighting tall, heavy guys, for me, is controlling the distance. I increase and decrease distancing on my terms only. This could be accomplished through jabs, grip fighting, and/or breaking their balance.
  5. slamdunc is online now
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    Posted On:
    4/05/2014 3:34pm

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     Style: TKD, CMA & American Kenpo

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    They just throw some lame punches before trying to grapple you and overwhelm you with their weight (their only advanget)
    Let them throw their punches as you float in & out while countering. They will wear themselves out unless they are a fit fatty (rare breed).
    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    My instruction recommended circling them and tiring them with face punches before bringing them down with kicks to the shins/knees/ankles.
    Ask your instructor why he advocates face punches when there is so much body mass to have fun with.
    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    No grappling, no ground fighting with them.
    IMHO, I would do as much damage as possible while upright then YOU decide when it's time to go to the ground.
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    Size and weight are a real-world advantage. Don't try to downplay that.
    Absolutely true! Utilize what you have learned to take that advantage away. You need to be the one to keep him on the defensive and seize your opportunity.
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    The problem is real and obviously there, or you wouldn't be posting about it.
    There's got to be something to it even though he said:
    "I 6ft, fit, and can fight quite well on my feet or in the ground".
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    I grapple fatties all the time. If they are better than you in technique, then improve your technique. If they are stronger than you, then lift some weights. They key to fighting tall, heavy guys, for me, is controlling the distance. I increase and decrease distancing on my terms only. This could be accomplished through jabs, grip fighting, and/or breaking their balance.
    ^^^^ THIS ^^^^
    Use what you already have and develop what you don't have.
  6. Plasma is online now
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    Bullshido's Greatest Ninja

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    Posted On:
    4/05/2014 3:39pm

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     Style: JJJ/Judo[Nidan] BJJ[Blue]

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    How much BJJ do you have? When dealing with larger opponents ( you are larger than me) you can do anything from using a Muay Thai Plum to securing the under hooks.

    On the ground use distancing managing guards such as X, DLR, RDLR, etc. Look you probably just need to learn how to grapple.
  7. Petrus_Carter is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/05/2014 4:48pm


     Style: Krav Maga, Sambo, MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I can't thank you all enough. You've decades of experience between all of you it's definitely the kind of advice I needed.
    I'm gonna be more specific, I'm 198 pounds and my instructor is around 200. I can handle his weight and similar dude's weight with relatively little difficulty (I can lift him on my back without almost feeling it).
    I'm talking about dudes with weights from 220 on, and 6.5 and taller.
    I train on weights two hours a day three days a week and martial arts the other three.
    Grapples, takedowns, punches, good, not great, but not a sissy either.
    My instructor is shorter and stockier than me but he can take on those guys with great ease, but he also has decades of experience dealing with all kinds of body types.

    The problem is DEFINITELY real. I need to improve my techniques and also hear good advice from more experienced fighters like you.
    The main trouble here, at least for me is being uncomfortable. I had an accident with one of those fatsos two years ago and sprained my clavicle (I was leaner then).
    Since then on I'm quite uncomfortable fighting with people I feel have zero control over themselves (Aside from a few rough punches, I've never injured anyone, even by accident and I don't like the idea).
    Those kind of guys, just wanna put them down since I don't wanna risk another accident. I've no trouble with training injuries with responsible partners (they're actually a pretty good learning experience like I shared in a previous post) but those guys just piss the **** out of me.

    The deal is wanna improve my technique with somebody that may very possibly be much better, but who has enough control not to injure his sparring partner.
    Since you say it can be done, then it's gonna be done and those recommendations will be on the top of my list from now on.
  8. Plasma is online now
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    Posted On:
    4/06/2014 2:09am

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     Style: JJJ/Judo[Nidan] BJJ[Blue]

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    I can't thank you all enough. You've decades of experience between all of you it's definitely the kind of advice I needed.
    I'm gonna be more specific, I'm 198 pounds and my instructor is around 200. I can handle his weight and similar dude's weight with relatively little difficulty (I can lift him on my back without almost feeling it).
    I'm talking about dudes with weights from 220 on, and 6.5 and taller.
    So compared to me you are a large person. You have 25 pounds and a few inches. I deal with “dudes” the size you are referring to all the time (Germans are big people). Now I understand that you being a generally a large person it probably wasn’t common for you to fight people that were larger than you. But so is the way of the world.



    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    I train on weights two hours a day three days a week and martial arts the other three.
    You training in just Krav Maga? Honestly, I never lift weights, when I go to the gym is 90% cardio.


    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    Grapples, takedowns, punches, good, not great, but not a sissy either.
    My instructor is shorter and stockier than me but he can take on those guys with great ease, but he also has decades of experience dealing with all kinds of body types.
    Sounds like your technique is not good enough to handle the size and strength difference. Technique will triumph over size and strength if its good enough.


    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    The problem is DEFINITELY real. I need to improve my techniques and also hear good advice from more experienced fighters like you.
    The main trouble here, at least for me is being uncomfortable. I had an accident with one of those fatsos two years ago and sprained my clavicle (I was leaner then).
    Since then on I'm quite uncomfortable fighting with people I feel have zero control over themselves (Aside from a few rough punches, I've never injured anyone, even by accident and I don't like the idea).
    Those kind of guys, just wanna put them down since I don't wanna risk another accident. I've no trouble with training injuries with responsible partners (they're actually a pretty good learning experience like I shared in a previous post) but those guys just piss the **** out of me.

    The deal is wanna improve my technique with somebody that may very possibly be much better, but who has enough control not to injure his sparring partner.
    Since you say it can be done, then it's gonna be done and those recommendations will be on the top of my list from now on.
    What are you doing when they clinch in? What positions are you trying to aim for? How are they taking you down? When they take you down what position are you landing in?
  9. Petrus_Carter is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/06/2014 3:51am


     Style: Krav Maga, Sambo, MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Plasma, thank you VERY much for your advice. I definitely need more work on my techniques, I barely have two years of training mixing BJJ and Krav Maga. The lift weighting was a suggestion of my instructor to build strength in between classes and it has definitely increased my strength and together with cardio has allowed me to have a much greater endurance I used to have.
    During takedowns I land on my back or my chest, and I can roll with the movement and use the momentum against them. For takedowns we use leg grapples or shirt grabs (English is not my native tongue so I don't know the technical names of the movements but pretty much standard BJJ beginners takedowns).
    I've fought guys taller than me (one was 6.5 feet and weighted almost the same as the fatso) and he beat me but I definitely enjoyed the of that sparring (great guy, very smart, gave me lots of advice, and was an excellent professional in sambo).

    The thing I should make clear it's not the height and not the weight in itself that makes me uncomfortable, it's the lack of control.
    I can't enjoy my sparring sessions if I'm with an unreliable partner, I get tense and I simply lose all flexibility (worst thing to do). Normally, I can continue a takedown and roll with it like nothing and spent 20 minutes looking for that submission without even getting tired.
    I was simply practicing a shirt/leg takedown with this guy, he fell upon me and crashed my shoulder. I don't know exactly how that happened but it hurt like hell.
    The dude was a bit taller than me, paunchy (215) and very uncoordinated.
    That's why I'm asking advice here. I don't wanna have another incident like this, they can punch me, kick me, grapple me and submit me, I'll take it, it's part of the training but I don't want another of those tubs of lard on me.
    Like black monk said, height and weight matter and I wanted to know, how the **** do I stop 220 pounds of lard from crushing me? (not him and not someone similar, but someone real where I don't have to worry about the rules)
    I saw in another thread where they recommended a guy with a similar build and height to avoid grappling a fat judo guy and keep moving around him.
    http://www.bullshido.net/forums/show...770&highlight=
    All of your advice so far has been fantastic. Thank you.
  10. Plasma is online now
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    Posted On:
    4/07/2014 11:39am

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     Style: JJJ/Judo[Nidan] BJJ[Blue]

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    Plasma, thank you VERY much for your advice. I definitely need more work on my techniques, I barely have two years of training mixing BJJ and Krav Maga.
    2 years is not a beginner. You should be at least a BJJ Blue by now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    The lift weighting was a suggestion of my instructor to build strength in between classes and it has definitely increased my strength and together with cardio has allowed me to have a much greater endurance I used to have.
    Good.

    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    During takedowns I land on my back or my chest, and I can roll with the movement and use the momentum against them. For takedowns we use leg grapples or shirt grabs (English is not my native tongue so I don't know the technical names of the movements but pretty much standard BJJ beginners takedowns).
    Your English is better than my Espanol so we will have to continue in English. Sounds like you are referring to either a double leg takedown or a single leg takedown. I would work on securing your own under hooks and sprawling when you can't. Do not let them get a hold of your leg.

    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus_Carter View Post
    I've fought guys taller than me (one was 6.5 feet and weighted almost the same as the fatso) and he beat me but I definitely enjoyed the of that sparring (great guy, very smart, gave me lots of advice, and was an excellent professional in sambo).

    The thing I should make clear it's not the height and not the weight in itself that makes me uncomfortable, it's the lack of control.
    I can't enjoy my sparring sessions if I'm with an unreliable partner, I get tense and I simply lose all flexibility (worst thing to do). Normally, I can continue a takedown and roll with it like nothing and spent 20 minutes looking for that submission without even getting tired.
    I was simply practicing a shirt/leg takedown with this guy, he fell upon me and crashed my shoulder. I don't know exactly how that happened but it hurt like hell.
    The dude was a bit taller than me, paunchy (215) and very uncoordinated.
    That's why I'm asking advice here. I don't wanna have another incident like this, they can punch me, kick me, grapple me and submit me, I'll take it, it's part of the training but I don't want another of those tubs of lard on me.
    Like black monk said, height and weight matter and I wanted to know, how the **** do I stop 220 pounds of lard from crushing me? (not him and not someone similar, but someone real where I don't have to worry about the rules)
    I saw in another thread where they recommended a guy with a similar build and height to avoid grappling a fat judo guy and keep moving around him.
    http://www.bullshido.net/forums/show...770&highlight=
    All of your advice so far has been fantastic. Thank you.
    When being taken down, make sure you get some sort of distance managing guard using your foot or shin to prevent their weight from coming down on you.

    For example:
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