Posted On:3/22/2014 10:44am
Style: Muay Thai
I seek the wisdom at the top of the PT forum mountain. I seem to be having an issue with my squat, so I got some video from this morning. Any suggestions, comments, "oh god stop that now" reactions?
The first video, on a warmup set-
My first work set, failing on rep number four-
I can see I didn't get deep enough on the last one. Any critiques other than that?
Edit- what the ****, my links aren't showing up.
Last edited by Neo Sigma; 3/22/2014 11:01am at .
Posted On:3/22/2014 11:52am
Let's try this again...
Warmup set, where I felt things looked pretty good-
Work set, where I flopped-
You have to work the look.
Posted On:3/22/2014 12:21pm
Your feet are pointing outwards a lot. Now, I don't buy into the totally parallel stance, but you need to get yours much closer to parallel than you are right now.
I'd say it's taking you a huge amount of effort just to prevent your knees buckling, and that's going to bugger your ability to get everything else right. Furthermore, you don't have the base to stop yourself rocking forward/backward once things do go pear-shaped and that's why you end up not finishing the lift.
What are you lifting, how long have you been at it, and how much do you weigh?
EDIT: Oh, and how comfortably can you drop into a squat, with your heels on the floor, and stay there without a bar on your back or your hands held out front?
Last edited by CrackFox; 3/22/2014 12:24pm at .
Posted On:3/22/2014 2:06pm
Style: Aikido/JJJ/Judo/GoJu Ryu
The wider your stance the more your toes should be pointed out. Yours are slightly to the extreme, but not too bad. You are in more of a competitive powerlifting stance. I go just past shoulder width. I practice wide stance but I need to loosen up my hips more, well more so my groin. Toes out help keep the knees from buckling.
Think "show crotch, show chest"
Meaning push chest out, and keep your crotch open, this solidifies your stance
On to the video.
Your basically doing a deadlift with the bar on your back...you are doing back extensions. Yes, the bar is supposed to go up and down in a straight line - but not with your head bending over your hips.
You need to work on hip drive. Push your hips through on your top movement. You tube back squat hip drive and you should find some stuff. I follow a derivative of West Side Barbell (Louis Simmons) technique.
If you have access to three inch bands, set up for band squats...that helps with hip drive.
here's a link to a band squat:
Posted On:3/22/2014 2:14pm
If you look at your video, you are hitching at your back. You should be thinking about driving through your heels and pushing your hips through.
Basically you need to drop weight. When your hips are underdeveloped and/or tight you tend to let the weight flow into your back and you bend over your waist as your body finds it easier to do that than do the actual squat...path of least resistance and all that.
You can do box squats as well. Find a suitable height for a box, and be sure to let the weight rest before you come up off the box and off your feet, then drive up as powerfully as you can.
here's a box squat. box is a little high.
Last edited by daishi; 3/22/2014 2:19pm at .
Posted On:3/22/2014 2:20pm
If you look at the rep you failed on, your hips moved up before your back/shoulders.
Posted On:3/22/2014 2:23pm
What are you lifting, how long have you been at it, and how much do you weigh?
I assume you mean pounds there. That was 210 that I attempted and screwed up. I kinda figured I need to take some weight off, I just wanted to get some feedback before I deload and make the same mistakes. Been doing the practical programming version of Starting Strength since this past October, weighing 165 now.
I'd say it's taking you a huge amount of effort just to prevent your knees buckling, and that's going to bugger your ability to get everything else right.
Yeah, you're right. I have to make a concerted effort to keep my knees pointed outward on the way up. I can feel I don't really have a lot of power out of the hole, I just couldn't pinpoint why.
If you look at your video, you are hitching at your back.
What exactly do you mean by that?
Last edited by Neo Sigma; 3/22/2014 2:47pm at .
Posted On:3/22/2014 5:38pm
when you are in your down position, your hips are too weak to hold proper form while supporting 210lbs so you naturally "slip" the weight to your back, as that's the next thing on your body....so all that weight goes up your back and you are bent over, your legs kind of **** down, and you only bend your at the hip joint, essentially doing a Hello Dolly at 210lbs...which is real hard. So it's basically a meaning you have flexibility or strength issues...it's probably the most common issues have with a standard back squat. You see this a lot especially with guys who have been doing half or quarter squats for a long time, work up to some weight doing that, then try to actually do a full squat...they have muscular imbalance between their legs and hips/core. A proper back squat is going to work your hamstrings, core, and lower posterior chain more so than your quads. When people say their quads are sore and not their ass, back of their legs, they are likely doing half squats.
Posted On:3/22/2014 5:45pm
If I were having the same issues (which I still do sometimes) I do the following;
-Three second hold at the bottom of the movement, form check in mirror. Maybe do six sets of three.
-Stretch your hips, hamstrings and lower back every time you squat...before and after. Always do corrective stretching.
Other good tools:
- Box squats. As per the vid, squat down, let yourself settle on box, and drive up fast. Helps so you don't hitch or get hung up on the bottom of the movement. These are nice because you don't necessarily need a partner and can go a little heavy.
-Band squats. You def need a partner for this. Helps simulate heavy weight without actually putting yourself under load. Any band compounding is going to amplify issues in your form as well, particular lack if stability.
Posted On:3/22/2014 6:14pm
Originally Posted by Neo Sigma
I assume you mean pounds there.
Well, I'd prefer kilos, but I can do arithmetic in my head so it's all good
That was 210 that I attempted and screwed up. I kinda figured I need to take some weight off, I just wanted to get some feedback before I deload and make the same mistakes. Been doing the practical programming version of Starting Strength since this past October, weighing 165 now.
Yeah, you probably need to reset around now. The thing about Starting Strength is that as it's linear progression, and the body doesn't adapt in a linear manner, it starts off really easy, but soon it's progressing too fast.
You've broken 200lbs, that's a nice psychological milestone. I think now though it's time to put the idea of lifting heavier weights on the back burner for a while, and start concentrating on doing really quality lifts. Really get a good idea of what you're supposed to be doing and start doing it right.
As you can see from the posts even just in this thread, people are always just gagging to give you advice on how to do a squat, and a lot of them don't have a clue what they are talking about, so it's a bit of a minefield. I'm not going to try and convince you who's right and who's wrong, as I'm no expert myself. For all I know I could be the one who is wrong.
The first thing I think you should do is get some real life coaching. Seriously, it's miles beyond the advice you'll get online, and it doesn't take long to see a big improvement in squat form when you're getting good feedback.
The second thing I think you should do is forget about anything with props or bands or any complications like that. You need to practice squatting. Not with a bar on your back, not with some other add on. Just practice dropping into a good squat. Do it two or three times per day. Check out this video:
I think 10 mins is excessive, I think you'd be better off dropping into the squat, pausing until you know you're not going to fall over and then repeating. If you hunt through that guy's videos he has a lot of good stuff, but don't get sucked too far down the rabbit hole - a lot of his stuff is just filler to keep people clicking
You should also work on your ankle flexibility. Everyone should probably work on their ankle mobility. Have a look at this:
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