224770 Bullies, 3627 online  
  • Register
Our Sponsors:

Results 11 to 14 of 14
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Sponsored Links Spacer Image
  1. RynoGreene is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    226

    Posted On:
    1/10/2014 6:05pm


     Style: FMA/SAMBO

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hopefully Aaron will chime in here, but we were always taught that if you're going to turtle, it had better be an active turtle. Don't just camp out, look to force reactions from your opponent, and look to improve your position.

    I've got a bad knee and sit outs while under pressure have sprained it twice in the last two years, so I'm not using that too much any more. It sucks being old and broken.

    If I have to turtle, I don't want to be flat-backed, and give them and easy ride. I'll keep curve to my spine so that if they try to get rear mount, they'll slide off the top and I can exit the back door. I avoid ever staying in the flat log position. I'll fight to get at least a low turtle to begin fighting, trying to face them, and get them off balance and get to a high four so that I have some space to work. This will open up options.

    Once I've squared to them, unloaded their weight from me, and got to something like a high four, my preference is:

    1. Re-guard/immediate sweep
    2. Square up completely and look to regain upright posture for counter
    3. Stand up

    I used to like to stand up more but due to my f'd up knee and the scrambling that often occurs getting to that, it is just a bit more risky than it used to be. I used to use sit-outs. Other than that, I generally just try to unweight him while I'm in my turtle so that I can move a bit, then square up. Once squared, regain posture, and look for reversal or stand back up.

    Barrel rolls and rolling kneebars are tons of fun against noobs. I've got a very good clamp, so surprise some more advance folks with the barrel roll sometimes, even if their weight isn't too far over.

    For the re-guard/sweep options, hip heist sweep, butterfly/half butterfly, and flower are my go-to's. I also like the forward roll/spin to re-guard if he's blocking my knee from coming through.
    Last edited by RynoGreene; 1/10/2014 6:10pm at .
  2. sambosteve is offline
    sambosteve's Avatar

    Stillness is death

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    3,888

    Posted On:
    1/12/2014 8:34pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     NY Combat Sambo Style: combat sambo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by BKR View Post
    A good drill we used to do was have one guy turtle, the other stay on top. The object was for the guy on bottom to get up/away and onto his feet or reverse somehow. You can restrict it to standing up, recovering guard, whatever. The guy on top was to keep the guy on bottom on bottom.

    We spent fucking hours doing that between the time I was a brown belt (sankyu) and shodan.
    We do this drill ALOT. Start in turtle and get to the feet from consecutive attackers coming in at different angles. It is incredibly helpful. Like you I try to keep my head towards the guy on top of me. But, I will often try to bait him so I can set up and arm roll or granby if he comes to the side of me to get wrist control (or collar control on a jacket).

    You are also right that peek outs can be risky and give up pins against more experienced guys if you fail. Having said that, I love them and drill my guys to do peek outs in combination. I find that many folks (newer guys especially, but not always) stop after the first peek out. Like most techs, the first does not always cut the mustard. Usually the top man will move to counter the first peek out and you have got to nail a second in the opposite direction straight away. Also important is the direction of the peek out relative to the attackers arms on your body (is he in a north south position, side control position, wrist control, nelsons, etc.

    Pulling guard is definitely an option, but I do love a good scramble ;) I feel safer there as I know my guard game is not my best attribute. But, I will pull guard for sure if I have to.

    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    Turning to face them is something I see a lot in higher-level sambo matches. The obvious application, I suppose, is being able to see your opponent for a takedown.
    Yep...looking for ankle picks and leg locks ;) If the do go to referee's, then rolling kneebar. I will try to set that up too.
    Last edited by sambosteve; 1/12/2014 8:38pm at .
    One of the best Bullshido investigations ever written: http://www.bullshido.org/David_Kujawski_Investigation

    "disgruntled ex student who couldn't hack training with Dave and his material and opted out (could be called pussied out) of training to go to Sambo" - Mor Sao
  3. sambosteve is offline
    sambosteve's Avatar

    Stillness is death

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    3,888

    Posted On:
    1/12/2014 8:38pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     NY Combat Sambo Style: combat sambo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by RynoGreene View Post
    Hopefully Aaron will chime in here, but we were always taught that if you're going to turtle, it had better be an active turtle. Don't just camp out, look to force reactions from your opponent, and look to improve your position.
    100% agree. IMO it should be considered a transitional position. Constant movement. I am speaking generally, not referring to a rule set where you know the ref will save your ass)
    One of the best Bullshido investigations ever written: http://www.bullshido.org/David_Kujawski_Investigation

    "disgruntled ex student who couldn't hack training with Dave and his material and opted out (could be called pussied out) of training to go to Sambo" - Mor Sao
  4. blackmonk is online now
    blackmonk's Avatar

    Welterweight

    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    878

    Posted On:
    1/13/2014 11:24am

    supporting member
     Style: belt and jacket wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It might be an interesting project to develop a comprehensive way to deal with the various problems that the turtle or par terre positions present, from a sambo perspective.

    All of these ideas are great, and of course valuable, but I'd love to have a specific curriculum to start the n00bs out with... Like "right hand goes here", "left knee tucked to chest", etc., rather than just have someone attack them and they scramble.

    What I ultimately want to develop is a complete framework for how to return to standing, with the jacket on. Nogi is mostly different, and the dissonance that I experience between the two is sometimes frustrating.
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Powered by vBulletin™© contact@vbulletin.com vBulletin Solutions, Inc. 2011 All rights reserved.