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  1. gregaquaman is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/12/2013 10:43pm


     Style: mma /boxing/muai thai

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If all you are dedicated to do is knocking somone on their arse find a core set of throws that support each other. So that each throw sets up an oportunity for the next throw untill you go back to the origional one.

    Then just rep that on the other guy like a machine untill he falls over.

    Not sure if that is judo. Just kind of putting it out there.
    Whitsunday Martial Arts Airlie Beach North Queensland.
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  2. judojeff is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/13/2013 7:13pm


     Style: Judo

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Everything will depend on the club, some are very competition oriented and cater to athletes looking to establish themselves as national competitors, others (mine) are more recreational in nature and cater to folks who enjoy the competitive side of the art but are in it mainly for other reasons (fun, exercise, etc). There are also clubs who reside somewhere in the middle of the spectrum.

    A good coach will teach you the core throws first as the skills developed by learning these throws transfer directly to the more advanced ones. Many of these core throws are also big time shiai throws (seoi nage, o soto gari, etc).

    As far as learning banned techniques goes, that will depend on the school. Mine is more then willing to teach them, however we do not use them in randori unless training for a tournament in which the rule set allows them. Example being that in 2 weeks there is a local sub grappling tournament so we have been drilling take down defense as well as leg attacks (throws and leg locks) as well as allowing them in randori.
  3. Mr.HoneyBadger is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/13/2013 8:10pm


     Style: Judo/BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by gregaquaman View Post
    If all you are dedicated to do is knocking somone on their arse find a core set of throws that support each other. So that each throw sets up an oportunity for the next throw untill you go back to the origional one.

    Then just rep that on the other guy like a machine untill he falls over.

    Not sure if that is judo. Just kind of putting it out there.
    That's an interesting Idea, I'll have to try that out sometime.

    Recently I found out that a friend of a friend is a Black Belt in Judo and has trained at the Kodokan. I'll ask him some of these questions if I get the chance.

    I think I'm mostly interested in older Judo, the Judo that was taught to W.E. Faribairn and Oshchepkov, the founder of SAMBO. I want to mix it with my catch wrestling and San Da. Maybe it's not all that different from newer Judo. But it seems like Judo today is much more restrictive (could be wrong about that.)
  4. gregaquaman is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/14/2013 11:13am


     Style: mma /boxing/muai thai

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.HoneyBadger View Post
    That's an interesting Idea, I'll have to try that out sometime.

    Recently I found out that a friend of a friend is a Black Belt in Judo and has trained at the Kodokan. I'll ask him some of these questions if I get the chance.

    I think I'm mostly interested in older Judo, the Judo that was taught to W.E. Faribairn and Oshchepkov, the founder of SAMBO. I want to mix it with my catch wrestling and San Da. Maybe it's not all that different from newer Judo. But it seems like Judo today is much more restrictive (could be wrong about that.)
    high percentage basics are just that restrictive ruleset or not. There is a reason we still double leg people.
    Whitsunday Martial Arts Airlie Beach North Queensland.
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  5. judojeff is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/14/2013 11:44am


     Style: Judo

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.HoneyBadger View Post
    That's an interesting Idea, I'll have to try that out sometime.

    Recently I found out that a friend of a friend is a Black Belt in Judo and has trained at the Kodokan. I'll ask him some of these questions if I get the chance.

    I think I'm mostly interested in older Judo, the Judo that was taught to W.E. Faribairn and Oshchepkov, the founder of SAMBO. I want to mix it with my catch wrestling and San Da. Maybe it's not all that different from newer Judo. But it seems like Judo today is much more restrictive (could be wrong about that.)
    Judo is judo, old new whatever. The current competition rule set is more restrictive then it was, but luckily you dont have to train for that, assuming you have like minded partners. Now if you do intend to compete in judo then making a double leg your go to throw is dumb, but nothing is stopping you from learning pickups, or leg locks, or what have you. Just dont expect a judo club to spend a good deal of time going over these things, especially if its a competion oriented club.
  6. Mr.HoneyBadger is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/14/2013 8:50pm


     Style: Judo/BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by judojeff View Post
    Judo is judo, old new whatever. The current competition rule set is more restrictive then it was, but luckily you dont have to train for that, assuming you have like minded partners. Now if you do intend to compete in judo then making a double leg your go to throw is dumb, but nothing is stopping you from learning pickups, or leg locks, or what have you. Just dont expect a judo club to spend a good deal of time going over these things, especially if its a competion oriented club.

    Are most of the clubs competition oriented now in your opinion? I guess I'll try to just learn whatever Kodokan throws I find useful, and the basic ones I'm shown, and from there I'll just add what I like to do from other styles (not in comp but in sparring and stuff)

    Are pick ups and double legs a part of judo, though? Like will most black belts know those moves/be willing to teach them if your interested?

    Quote Originally Posted by gregaquaman View Post
    high percentage basics are just that restrictive ruleset or not. There is a reason we still double leg people.
    O.K. so I guess I'll learn basic Judo techniques and principles and then just mix it with some of my other stuff I've learned/ I'm learning. Thanks man :)
  7. NeilG is online now
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    Posted On:
    10/14/2013 9:47pm


     Style: Kendo

    3
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm trying to think of the Japanese term for you as a student type - I think it's "PITA-san". You're coming into this with some really specific ideas of what you think judo should be about, how's about you go try to learn some judo and then decide later if you like it or not? Empty your ^&*^#* cup, already.
  8. gregaquaman is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/14/2013 11:35pm


     Style: mma /boxing/muai thai

    3
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.HoneyBadger View Post
    Are most of the clubs competition oriented now in your opinion? I guess I'll try to just learn whatever Kodokan throws I find useful, and the basic ones I'm shown, and from there I'll just add what I like to do from other styles (not in comp but in sparring and stuff)

    Are pick ups and double legs a part of judo, though? Like will most black belts know those moves/be willing to teach them if your interested?



    O.K. so I guess I'll learn basic Judo techniques and principles and then just mix it with some of my other stuff I've learned/ I'm learning. Thanks man :)
    Sorry the double leg as an idea. It is the first throw you learn in MMA and the one you will most use. The trick to making throws work is to be good at them. Not to have the trickyest tricks.

    Judo will have moves that work. Otherwise nobody would ever fall over in a comp. I still box even with its restrictive rule set
    Whitsunday Martial Arts Airlie Beach North Queensland.
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  9. judojeff is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/15/2013 10:27am


     Style: Judo

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.HoneyBadger View Post
    Are most of the clubs competition oriented now in your opinion? I guess I'll try to just learn whatever Kodokan throws I find useful, and the basic ones I'm shown, and from there I'll just add what I like to do from other styles (not in comp but in sparring and stuff)

    Are pick ups and double legs a part of judo, though? Like will most black belts know those moves/be willing to teach them if your interested?
    In my very limited experiance, yes and no. All clubs who have active competitors will train you for the comps, this does not mean that they never break away from the rules in practice, just that how often they do this will vary.

    I believe that most dan grades will have at the very least a working knowledge of pickups and be willing to teach them, however there use in randori (especially by newbs) may be frowned apon, you certainly wont be helping yourself develop strong judo by focusing on a pickup heavy game.
  10. BKR is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/15/2013 8:15pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kodokan Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.HoneyBadger View Post
    I'm not interested, at all really, in training to get to the olympics. I've heard that that mindset is pissing some Judoka off, because as opposed to Judo being for people who want to do something healthy, fun, etc. , it is more about trying to get one of your guys into the olympics. I don't know if it's true, I've just heard that opinion espoused before.

    Will a judo coach teach you the older moves not used in competition now? (ex. the ones involving leg grabs?) That's one of my main worries about doing judo, the ruleset.

    Judo seems to have A LOT of rules, and some of which seem to make it less, I don't know, less like Kano's judo?
    How Judo is trained has been highly influenced by the (then) current ruleset for a long, long time. SOME judo clubs are very focused on competition. Those will more than likely NOT teach currently illegal techniques. You will need to check the idividual club. But don't go spouting stuff about "Kano's Judo" unless you want either blank looks or laughed at.

    I mean, which "Kano's Judo" are you talking about?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.HoneyBadger View Post
    The catch ruleset we use is any hold is o.k., any throw is o.k. No hitting, no biting, no kicking (common sense no-no's of grappling arts) So it allows for a lot of variation and techniques from different arts. You win by pin or by submission.
    Seriously, any throw is legal? No restrictions on landing? Throwing while applying an armbar? [/QUOTE]

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.HoneyBadger View Post
    I'm not interested, at all really, in training to get to the olympics. I've heard that that mindset is pissing some Judoka off, because as opposed to Judo being for people who want to do something healthy, fun, etc. , it is more about trying to get one of your guys into the olympics. I don't know if it's true, I've just heard that opinion espoused before.

    Will a judo coach teach you the older moves not used in competition now? (ex. the ones involving leg grabs?) That's one of my main worries about doing judo, the ruleset.

    Judo seems to have A LOT of rules, and some of which seem to make it less, I don't know, less like Kano's judo?
    How Judo is trained has been highly influenced by the (then) current ruleset for a long, long time. SOME judo clubs are very focused on competition. Those will more than likely NOT teach currently illegal techniques. You will need to check the idividual club. But don't go spouting stuff about "Kano's Judo" unless you want either blank looks or laughed at.

    I mean, which "Kano's Judo" are you talking about?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.HoneyBadger View Post
    The catch ruleset we use is any hold is o.k., any throw is o.k. No hitting, no biting, no kicking (common sense no-no's of grappling arts) So it allows for a lot of variation and techniques from different arts. You win by pin or by submission.
    Seriously, any throw is legal? No restrictions on landing? Throwing while applying an armbar? [/QUOTE]
    Falling for Judo since 1980
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