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  1. Dork Angel is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/16/2013 10:45am


     Style: Jujitsu Aikido Bodycombat

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    See, this is what drvies me nuts about TMAers. We create impossibly stupid scenarios so we can "stand by our statements."

    Seriously, how do you get this:



    Out of this?
    Reluctant as I am to bring any sort of serious to this tongue in cheek thread, I would say it's the difference between a push and a shoulder tackle/collision.
  2. Zargor is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/16/2013 10:47am

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     Style: Staying Alive

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Dork Angel View Post
    Reluctant as I am to bring any sort of serious to this tongue in cheek thread, I would say it's the difference between a push and a shoulder tackle/collision.
    Mate, have you been taking hair-splitting classes lately? Come on, do you seriously advocate somebody pulling off a Superman instead of ANY form of tackle?
  3. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/16/2013 10:59am

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     Style: xingyi

    2
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Dork Angel View Post
    Reluctant as I am to bring any sort of serious to this tongue in cheek thread
    You brought it the minute you said this:
    You've just ran at him from 20 feet away and tried to push him. That's the one attack he's spent his entire life learning to defend against. Of course it is possible he will freeze up because he knows so many different ways to do that...
    I would say it's the difference between a push and a shoulder tackle/collision.

    Southpaw never said tackle.
  4. Dork Angel is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/16/2013 11:04am


     Style: Jujitsu Aikido Bodycombat

    0
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Zargor View Post
    Mate, have you been taking hair-splitting classes lately? Come on, do you seriously advocate somebody pulling off a Superman instead of ANY form of tackle?
    The original post this spawned from was specifically about the difference between a standing push and a running push. It was not about Aikido being effective against any sort of running attack. In fact it wasn't about Aikido at all, it was just the mental image I got of it happening matched the only attack I thought Aikido would be any use against. Once you change it to tackles and shoulder charges, Aikido returns to being as useless as always.
  5. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/16/2013 11:11am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Dork Angel View Post
    The original post this spawned from was specifically about the difference between a standing push and a running push. It was not about Aikido being effective against any sort of running attack. In fact it wasn't about Aikido at all, it was just the mental image I got of it happening matched the only attack I thought Aikido would be any use against. Once you change it to tackles and shoulder charges, Aikido returns to being as useless as always.
  6. Bluto Blutarsky is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/16/2013 12:13pm


     Style: Mostly drinking. E-chaun

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    the problem with chun and many cmas (speaking as someone training in one now) is that there is often a huge disconnect between "theory" and "application". not just cmas, but many styles.

    on the issue of trapping, I don't train in wing chun, but the theory of it (to my understanding and how we use it) is to get in, tie up the guys defenses, then unleash a combo and reset. I don't see it any differently than slipping a punch (the guys defences are momentarily tied up) and responding. the only difference being you are manufacturing the distraction in a way that might make many people uncomfortable. if the guy moves backwards you have an opening to kick or close the distance (if you have greater range) - but that's an application and sparring learned skill not a theory thing. and you would treat them like any fighter retreating.

    maybe the problem often is that when you train a cma- any cma (and many other styles) in such a way people aren't used to seeing because there are so many clowns out there and on youtube with absurd videos and unrealistic applications, people might expect to see something totally different to the point a stick up the ass "traditionalist" cma guy would say "yeah it works, but its not ______".
    kiss my ass-
    who cares what you think it looks like?
    a hit is a hit, I don't care if it came from boxing, or muai thai or xingyi wing chun or kyokoshin principals or whatnot.

    if some one can train hard, and gets into the ufc and uses wing chun principals (among other things I would imagine) I don't see that as so far fetched at all. but its probably not as simple as any of us can generalize in a few words on the internet. I would almost guarantee you would have tons of crotchety old men coming out of the woodwork saying "thats not wc".
  7. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/16/2013 2:00pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Here, let me tell you the simple problem with trapping. 99% of the chunners were taught incorrectly. If I was so inclined, I could show you videos of other arts doing it right. I've watched boxers, Kick boxers, people in K-1, and the UFC use it correctly. Yes, in the same way CHUNNERS claim to understand better than anyone.

    The problem lies in most want to look like this:


    Instead of like this:


    Yep, same concept different actions and training.
  8. baby_cart is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/16/2013 8:54pm


     Style: ex-BJJ, ex-TKD

    -1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Southpaw View Post

    Let's try an experiment to test whether or not moving makes it difficult to "get grounded" for increased power.

    1. Stand in front of a buddy, 1 foot apart.
    2. Without moving your feet...get nice and grounded...push him as hard as you can and measure the distance backward he falls.

    Then...

    1. Stand 20 yards from your friend and start running towards him as fast as you can.
    2. When you get close enough to him push the living **** out of him. Measure the distance he travels backward.

    That's pretty simple. Forward momentum wins. Also, you can ask your friend which one felt like it had more power. I'm guessing it was the 2nd one.
    are there wing chun exercises that train that forward momentum from outside trapping/infighting range?
  9. BKR is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/16/2013 9:05pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kodokan Judo

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    Here, let me tell you the simple problem with trapping. 99% of the chunners were taught incorrectly. If I was so inclined, I could show you videos of other arts doing it right. I've watched boxers, Kick boxers, people in K-1, and the UFC use it correctly. Yes, in the same way CHUNNERS claim to understand better than anyone.

    The problem lies in most want to look like this:


    Instead of like this:


    Yep, same concept different actions and training.
    The bottom video is a great example of one on one training, regardless of the concept(s) involved.
    Falling for Judo since 1980
  10. atheistmantis is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/16/2013 11:36pm

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     Style: Tang Soo Don't Retired

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    WC has no place in MMA. Forget "science" because there is none. Give it up and let it go. The only way that you will truly know if it works is in the cage. Go there and report back.
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