228144 Bullies, 4762 online  
  • Register
Our Sponsors:

Results 41 to 50 of 144
Page 5 of 15 FirstFirst 12345 6789 ... LastLast
Sponsored Links Spacer Image
  1. CrackFox is offline
    CrackFox's Avatar

    You have to work the look.

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Bat Country
    Posts
    3,077

    Posted On:
    6/26/2014 3:42pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    So first up, they're not hiding that agenda, they have it written on their website for all to see, and more importantly how does that give any reason to ignore their findings on police militarisation, heavy handed tactics, and lack of oversight?
  2. alex is offline
    alex's Avatar

    STOP POSTING!

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    8,203

    Posted On:
    6/26/2014 3:55pm

    supporting member
     Style: Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    im not an american so my opinion probably isnt wanted or even very accurate but from what i can see, police have one of two agendas-

    1- protect and serve
    2- get the bad guys

    both are important but it seems to me some cops stretch too far into number 2 and that it can be a bit of a culture thing. in little old new zealand cops arent armed unless there is an armed callout (QUITE rare, peolpe here are for the most part unarmed) and will generally do what they can to ensure peoples safety rather than try and bust people for stuff. drinking in a liquor ban area? pour it out. public intoxication? theyll give you a lift home if you arent a dick about it. we have our own version of cops called police 10-7, and the contrast in the way things operate is night and day. obviously sometimes **** goes awry and a nightstick comes into play but that is a last resort. obviously its sanitised for tv, but my own experience with them, and most people i know, has been similar. of course you always get a few people who claim the cops are pricks and beat up on them etc, but those people i know personally who complain about that are also the kind of people who drink heavily and then make extremely bad choices afterwards.

    i was watching cops the other day- a drunk woman was yelling at a cop and threatening to beat him up. his 6'3 partner went round behind her, and rugby tackled her into the ground, smashing her face into the pavement. out cold. they both then yelled at her while wrenching her arms around, cuffing her, and dragging her unconscious bleeding frame into a paddy wagon. totally shocking to me, but apparently ok enough to put on tv and make her out to be the baddy.

    i dont know if i really have a point here. but if youre gonna condone fairly extreme levels of violence on members of the public as "ok" then people are going to take a negative view, and then it turns into an arms race. i would bet if cops here had a similar style they would get a shitload more hate than they do and be in a lot more danger in general. look at aussie for a case study in a country that is trying to emulate america in that regard. some of the **** you see going on in the police over there is horrendous and seems to be getting worse as they try and "americanise" their operations.
  3. CrackFox is offline
    CrackFox's Avatar

    You have to work the look.

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Bat Country
    Posts
    3,077

    Posted On:
    6/26/2014 4:07pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, BJJ

    3
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by alex View Post
    im not an american so my opinion probably isnt wanted or even very accurate but from what i can see, police have one of two agendas-

    1- protect and serve
    2- get the bad guys
    No 1 there is just the motto of the LAPD, it's not officially binding or anything. According the the US Supreme Court, the police do not have any constitutional duty to protect anyone. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Rock_v._Gonzales
  4. alex is offline
    alex's Avatar

    STOP POSTING!

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    8,203

    Posted On:
    6/26/2014 5:04pm

    supporting member
     Style: Muay Thai

    2
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    we have a much better motto.
    "always blow on the pie. safer communities together."
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7UX8KASASU
  5. CrackFox is offline
    CrackFox's Avatar

    You have to work the look.

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Bat Country
    Posts
    3,077

    Posted On:
    6/26/2014 6:02pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by alex View Post
    we have a much better motto.
    "always blow on the pie. safer communities together."
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7UX8KASASU
    It certainly beats "The policeman isn't there to create disorder, the policeman is there to preserve disorder."

    (Unfortunately, I couldn't dig up a video for that one.)

    Sent from my ZX Spectrum using TapTalk.
  6. slamdunc is online now
    slamdunc's Avatar

    Extraordinarily Ordinary

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    2,173

    Posted On:
    6/26/2014 8:02pm

    supporting member
     Style: TKD, CMA & American Kenpo

    0
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by CrackFox View Post
    I believe the ACLU's are fairly clear about what their agenda is. They spell it out on their website for chrissakes.
    Originally Posted by ACLU
    defend and preserve the individual rights and liberties that the Constitution and laws of the United States guarantee everyone in this country
    That is their Mission Statement; their agenda may be a bit more complex.

    Quote Originally Posted by CrackFox View Post
    Ithey do not approve of the government operating paramilitary forces which attempt to use legal chicanery to avoid public oversight.
    Nor do I, ever, under any circumstances. I do, however, believe officer safety is paramount. I have arrested potentially violent criminals in plainclothes without back-up (not recommended, nor smart).

    On other occasions, I have participated in balls-to-the-wall SWAT assaults for armed, violent people who say things like "I'll die fighting before I go back to Menard (our local prison)". This is all situational and the people responsible for the safety of their men are the only ones to make the call on what level of force to exhibit / use.

    Those of you who have found it necessary to make these decisions will know what it takes, the rest cannot understand it.
  7. mike321 is online now

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,485

    Posted On:
    6/26/2014 8:24pm


     Style: kenpo, Wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by slamdunc View Post
    That is their Mission Statement; their agenda may be a bit more complex.

    Nor do I, ever, under any circumstances. I do, however, believe officer safety is paramount. I have arrested potentially violent criminals in plainclothes without back-up (not recommended, nor smart).

    On other occasions, I have participated in balls-to-the-wall SWAT assaults for armed, violent people who say things like "I'll die fighting before I go back to Menard (our local prison)". This is all situational and the people responsible for the safety of their men are the only ones to make the call on what level of force to exhibit / use.

    Those of you who have found it necessary to make these decisions will know what it takes, the rest cannot understand it.
    Slamdunc,

    I understand you don't go into a situation without accounting for safety. But police are civilians, if a threat is elevated beyond civilian law enforcement shouldn't military be called or maybe a higher level of law enforcement? Not a rhetorical question I am interested in your outlook. Also, another question: are no knock warrants worth it from a safety point of view? It seems like some lost evidence would be worth it from a public and officer safety point of view. Also grabbing a suspect outside of their house seems inherently safer anyway.
  8. slamdunc is online now
    slamdunc's Avatar

    Extraordinarily Ordinary

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    2,173

    Posted On:
    6/26/2014 11:16pm

    supporting member
     Style: TKD, CMA & American Kenpo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by mike321 View Post
    Slamdunc,

    I understand you don't go into a situation without accounting for safety. But police are civilians, if a threat is elevated beyond civilian law enforcement shouldn't military be called or maybe a higher level of law enforcement? Not a rhetorical question I am interested in your outlook. Also, another question: are no knock warrants worth it from a safety point of view? It seems like some lost evidence would be worth it from a public and officer safety point of view. Also grabbing a suspect outside of their house seems inherently safer anyway.
    In no particular order, here I go.
    In general, I am against no-knock warrants except in extreme situations where vital evidence could be destroyed or someone is in eminent danger.

    I would ALWAYS prefer to grab a suspect after he leaves home; you are 100% correct about the safety issue.

    When you refer to "a higher level of law enforcement", do you mean broader jurisdiction, an agency with more tactical assets or something else. I will put that one on hold until you clarify the question a bit.

    I wouldn't think of bringing in the military; I was a soldier and that's not what they do.
  9. mike321 is online now

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    California
    Posts
    1,485

    Posted On:
    6/27/2014 12:07am


     Style: kenpo, Wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Probably broader jurisdiction. Precinct calls city. Town calls county. If situation requires armored vehicles, call state police, etc. it seems like every jurisdiction has very high levels of capabilities.
  10. Cake of Doom is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    surrey, UK
    Posts
    803

    Posted On:
    6/27/2014 4:34am


     Style: Holiday Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by slamdunc
    I wouldn't think of bringing in the military; I was a soldier and that's not what they do.
    I would also add to that, that deploying troops in the home nation for law enforcement issues (other than risk of invasion, supporting law enforcement in riot situations), is a very sketchy political mine field. Should an extreme situation where that level of force is necessary occur, civilian LEO's with greater tactical assets would be a better option.
Page 5 of 15 FirstFirst 12345 6789 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Powered by vBulletin™© contact@vbulletin.com vBulletin Solutions, Inc. 2011 All rights reserved.