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  1. BKR is offline
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    My dog is cuter and smarter than yours.

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    Posted On:
    7/15/2013 6:19pm

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     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by NeilG View Post
    I thought "side control" was essentially mune-gatame, am I confoosed again?
    I think all the forms of Yoko Shiho Gatame (of which Mune Gatame is one variation) are considered "side control" in BJJ. The standard Yoko Shiho Gatame as in the Katame No Kata is "hon" Yoko Gatame", the rest are kuzure.
    Falling for Judo since 1980
  2. BKR is offline
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    My dog is cuter and smarter than yours.

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    Posted On:
    7/15/2013 6:26pm

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     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Quote Originally Posted by jnp View Post
    This. I prefer to have one knee pushing into their hip and the other pushing into their armpit. Remember to keep your butt as low as possible. An elevated rear end sets up all kinds of escape opportunities.

    If I am sprawling (meaning either one or both legs are straight) my hips are as low to the ground as I can get them without actually touching it. My knees never touch the ground. This means the only points of contact with the mat or my opponent is my chest (on my opponent) and my toes (on the mat).

    The shoulder into their chin to the point that it turns their head is also a very useful tip. This is commonly referred to as the "shoulder of justice" in BJJ.

    One last note, if your arms are in the common position of the arm nearest their head under their neck (crossface) and the arm closest to their legs under their far arm, pull toward your own knees with them. Most beginners mistakenly try to pull up toward the ceiling/sky. Your side control will be much stronger if you pull with your arms toward your knees, parallel to the mat/ground.


    Take Blackmonk's advice as well. He has a truly crushing side control. I know from personal experience.



    Side control is a generic term that encompasses a multitude of hand and leg/knee positions in BJJ.

    If you're talking about this,



    Attachment 15210


    then that is probably not what is being discussed here, although it would fall under the general heading of side control.

    This is the position most commonly used or referred to as side control in BJJ and the one I am describing above,


    Attachment 15211
    You don't' see the bottom one much in Judo. Looks like a "no gi" type of pin applied while wearing a jacket.

    I don't bring both knees up much anymore as I'm not as flexible as I used to be. I can't keep my ass down very well,LOL.

    In any case I usually keep my knee against their hip or put my other knee under their shoulder and keep the far leg away from their usual attempts at some sort of leg entanglement escape.

    "shoulder of justice" is hilarious. How about when you grab inside their thigh (the pants) and use the wrist as leverage on their crotch? Got a BJJ name for that one?

    Let me guess "fist fight"?
    Falling for Judo since 1980
  3. Bad Grappler is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/15/2013 8:22pm


     Style: BJJ

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thank you gentlemen! After trying everyone's advise and having an instructor watch, I learned why I was having such a hard time.

    1. I was getting my arm deep enough under their head, but wasn't applying enough pressure to keep them looking away and not holding on to anything, such as armpit.

    2. I would sprawl my legs out wide and on my toes, but was raising my hips higher to add more weight to them. Giving them space.

    3. I was trying to fight them from shrimping by muscling them down, and not moving my body with them. Basically just keeping my feet planted.

    4. And I wasn't doing anything with my other arm, just keeping an under hook.

    All in all, was able to start working on correcting these items and was able to hold a guy my size until he stopped trying to escape. Which lead to a baseball bat choke.

    I would have liked to have worked in side control more, but he stopped fighting it. I felt like a d!(k for afterwards because he barely even fought the submission.
  4. BKR is offline
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    My dog is cuter and smarter than yours.

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    Posted On:
    7/16/2013 10:58am

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     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Grappler View Post
    Thank you gentlemen! After trying everyone's advise and having an instructor watch, I learned why I was having such a hard time.

    1. I was getting my arm deep enough under their head, but wasn't applying enough pressure to keep them looking away and not holding on to anything, such as armpit.

    2. I would sprawl my legs out wide and on my toes, but was raising my hips higher to add more weight to them. Giving them space.

    3. I was trying to fight them from shrimping by muscling them down, and not moving my body with them. Basically just keeping my feet planted.

    4. And I wasn't doing anything with my other arm, just keeping an under hook.

    All in all, was able to start working on correcting these items and was able to hold a guy my size until he stopped trying to escape. Which lead to a baseball bat choke.

    I would have liked to have worked in side control more, but he stopped fighting it. I felt like a d!(k for afterwards because he barely even fought the submission.
    Good for you! Why feel like a dick (it's ok to write "dick" on Bullshido). The point of pins is to control/exhaust your opponent or force them to escape and in any case create an opening for a submission one way or the other. Now your training partners will have to get better at escapes, so it's a win-win.

    It is important to be able to move between control positions and maintain control too. That takes time, just like learning how to apply the pins does. Keep at it and you'll be fine. Eventually you can be one of those guys who everyone hates to have on top because it's impossible to move unless you let them.
    Falling for Judo since 1980
  5. Bad Grappler is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/16/2013 1:00pm


     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I felt like a dick because after he stopped trying to escape side mount it was like he just gave up. I took my time with setting up the choke and slowly applied pressure. But even after I believe he knew a choke was coming, he just put up a very weak one arm defense that didn't even cause me to adjust anything.

    I guess it's more of a feeling of guilt on mentally beating him since he started shortly after I did and he's only 20. I don't wanna be labeled as "that guy" or the cause of someone to quit so early in their bjj career
  6. BKR is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/16/2013 1:48pm

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     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Grappler View Post
    I felt like a dick because after he stopped trying to escape side mount it was like he just gave up. I took my time with setting up the choke and slowly applied pressure. But even after I believe he knew a choke was coming, he just put up a very weak one arm defense that didn't even cause me to adjust anything.

    I guess it's more of a feeling of guilt on mentally beating him since he started shortly after I did and he's only 20. I don't wanna be labeled as "that guy" or the cause of someone to quit so early in their bjj career
    Your care for your training partner is admirable, however, he did voluntarily engage in training in a full contact combat sport, so don't feel too bad. If I felt bad about that sort of thing I'd have committed suicide decades ago. You were not an ass about it...it's just training. Nobody gets better without "losing".
    Falling for Judo since 1980
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