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  1. #21
    W. Rabbit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by warlordgrego View Post
    I was merely pointing out that it doesn't necessarily jive with Christian ideals to practically idolize (My old Karate school practically had an altar to Tsuyoshi Chitose) the founder of a way of fighting.
    Which Christian ideals? I'm not aware of a commandment, beatitude, or gospel that says you can't bow as a show of respect to other people, living or dead. And many Christians have no problem praying to God to shed the blood of their enemies in war, or for that matter, football.

    And Idolize? I mean really, how much of class did you spend "idolizing" or more likely, saluting Chitose? A few seconds per class?

    Idolatry is really a different thing altogether...like Christians who worship enormous megachurches and golden tabernacles. It makes our humble sun toi and smiling Tang Fong portrait seem so...homely by comparison.

  2. #22

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Science is supposed to be unbiased. Then again, in a perfect world we would all use objective reasoning to make descisions or assumptions. Science should never be used to push agendas. The only thing science is supposwd to do is find information and relay the findings in an unsubjectified manor. Unfortunately, just as in all areas of life people are involved. There is no greater way to screw anything up than to involve humans.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by W. Rabbit View Post
    Which Christian ideals? I'm not aware of a commandment, beatitude, or gospel that says you can't bow as a show of respect to other people, living or dead. And many Christians have no problem praying to God to shed the blood of their enemies in war, or for that matter, football.

    And Idolize? I mean really, how much of class did you spend "idolizing" or more likely, saluting Chitose? A few seconds per class?

    Idolatry is really a different thing altogether...like Christians who worship enormous megachurches and golden tabernacles. It makes our humble sun toi and smiling Tang Fong portrait seem so...homely by comparison.
    Since when do Christian Ideals really have anything to do with whats in the Bible? I think you're characterizing things in that I view what we do as idoltry? I don't...but I've seen people walk out of Karate class because they were uncomfortable with having an altar to Chitose.

    I personally don't condemn or condone it. I have no problem at all with the tradition personally, I was just saying I found it odd to do these actions in a church when a lot of churches would have a problem with it.

    I don't care either way, I'm just there to train.

    EDIT:
    Looking back over my posts, I realize they're a bit nonsensical. Sorry if I made it look like I was critical of the practice of bowing in or whatever.
    Last edited by warlordgrego; 5/02/2013 6:50am at . Reason: Double posting. Weird.

  4. #24
    DerAuslander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by warlordgrego View Post
    Since when do Christian Ideals really have anything to do with whats in the Bible? I think you're characterizing things in that I view what we do as idoltry? I don't...but I've seen people walk out of Karate class because they were uncomfortable with having an altar to Chitose.

    I personally don't condemn or condone it. I have no problem at all with the tradition personally, I was just saying I found it odd to do these actions in a church when a lot of churches would have a problem with it.

    I don't care either way, I'm just there to train.

    EDIT:
    Looking back over my posts, I realize they're a bit nonsensical. Sorry if I made it look like I was critical of the practice of bowing in or whatever.
    You're a fucking idiot.

    Quote Originally Posted by warlordgrego View Post
    Since when do Christian Ideals really have anything to do with whats in the Bible? I think you're characterizing things in that I view what we do as idoltry? I don't...but I've seen people walk out of Karate class because they were uncomfortable with having an altar to Chitose.

    I personally don't condemn or condone it. I have no problem at all with the tradition personally, I was just saying I found it odd to do these actions in a church when a lot of churches would have a problem with it.

    I don't care either way, I'm just there to train.

    EDIT:
    Looking back over my posts, I realize they're a bit nonsensical. Sorry if I made it look like I was critical of the practice of bowing in or whatever.
    You're a fucking idiot.

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by DerAuslander View Post
    You're a fucking idiot.
    Won't argue that. Like I said, I mispoke. I sometimes have issues with explaining what I'm actually trying to say. Again, I wasn't trying to be critical of paying respect to lineage.

    Quote Originally Posted by DerAuslander View Post
    You're a fucking idiot.
    Won't argue that. Like I said, I mispoke. I sometimes have issues with explaining what I'm actually trying to say. Again, I wasn't trying to be critical of paying respect to lineage.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by warlordgrego View Post
    Since when do Christian Ideals really have anything to do with whats in the Bible?
    Nobody mentioned the Bible. You brought up Christian ideals, so I asked which you meant and you got defensive.

    Quote Originally Posted by warlordgrego View Post
    I think you're characterizing things in that I view what we do as idoltry?
    You implied that when you said "I was merely pointing out that it doesn't necessarily jive with Christian ideals to practically idolize".

    Obviously there are those who see it as idolatry. Those people are superstitious goofs.

    Quote Originally Posted by warlordgrego View Post
    I found it odd to do these actions in a church when a lot of churches would have a problem with it.
    Churches having problems with things...cie la vie.

    Quote Originally Posted by warlordgrego View Post
    Looking back over my posts, I realize they're a bit nonsensical. Sorry if I made it look like I was critical of the practice of bowing in or whatever.
    Quote Originally Posted by warlordgrego View Post
    Won't argue that. Like I said, I mispoke. I sometimes have issues with explaining what I'm actually trying to say. Again, I wasn't trying to be critical of paying respect to lineage.
    Your words were: "worship", "prostrate", "idolize".

    Maybe it is you who is really uncomfortable with the whole situation? If you're just there to train, train and stop dwelling on Carlson Gracie's photo.

    It's OK to focus on Jesus though, because you're in a church and wherever Jesus goes the Chi follows.
    Last edited by W. Rabbit; 5/02/2013 10:24am at .

  7. #27

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yeah, I used poor terminology in an attempt to bring my own experience in training in a church into a discussion about religion in martial arts. I also wasn't feeling defensive, I didn't mean to sound that way.

    I guess I was just trying to say that I had experience with people percieving the ritualisic aspects of martial arts as affrontery, so I was a bit surprised to see it practiced in a church.

    So, lesson learned. I'll put more thought into what I type.

    EDIT: Why is this double posting everytime?
    Last edited by warlordgrego; 5/02/2013 10:40am at .

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by warlordgrego View Post
    EDIT: Why is this double posting everytime?
    Buttsex.

    Quote Originally Posted by warlordgrego View Post
    EDIT: Why is this double posting everytime?
    Buttsex.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by DerAuslander View Post
    Buttsex.
    I one up you.
    Quote Originally Posted by DerAuslander View Post
    Buttsex.
    I one up you.
    Quote Originally Posted by DerAuslander View Post
    Buttsex.
    I one up you

  10. #30

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    I've read this entire thread as well as Orr's review of Harris's book. I'm having the same problem that Orr had with using an MRI to identify the regions in the brain where Harris drew his conclusions. Seems subjective to me. Still waiting for his books to arrive.

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