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  1. blackmonk is online now
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    Welterweight

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    Jun 2011
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    Austin, TX
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    844

    Posted On:
    4/18/2013 2:15pm

    supporting member
     Style: belt and jacket wrestling

    2
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Re: osaekomi/pinning in combat

    I always describe pinning, to n00bs, as an attack and therefore active. Not passive. Not "laying and praying".

    I wrote a bit about the celiac plexus, diaphragm, and hepatic protection in my training log, when speaking of pinning. It has scored me more than a few taps in sparring.
  2. lionknight is online now
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    Senior Member

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    Aug 2007
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    Wa
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    Posted On:
    4/18/2013 2:21pm


     Style: Much striking, SAMBO, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    As my pins have improved I’ve found that my submission skills have also improved. When I have a person pinned I can take my time and set up any submission I want to go for and make it work. Without the pin I am resigned to trying to “catch” the submission as it becomes available, if your opponent has a good flow then it can be like trying to catch water sometimes. With the pin I also have the ability to take their breath away and tire them out for a longer battle. I think the pin is often under appreciated by grapplers.
  3. lionknight is online now
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    4/18/2013 2:22pm


     Style: Much striking, SAMBO, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    I always describe pinning, to n00bs, as an attack and therefore active. Not passive. Not "laying and praying".

    I wrote a bit about the celiac plexus, diaphragm, and hepatic protection in my training log, when speaking of pinning. It has scored me more than a few taps in sparring.
    Yeah, I like getting a tap from a pin. Always fun on the new guy ;)
  4. Krijgsman is online now

    Registered Member

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    Pasadena, CA
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    557

    Posted On:
    4/18/2013 5:39pm


     Style: Judo noob, injured guy.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by lionknight View Post
    Without the pin I am resigned to trying to “catch” the submission as it becomes available, if your opponent has a good flow then it can be like trying to catch water sometimes. With the pin I also have the ability to take their breath away and tire them out for a longer battle. I think the pin is often under appreciated by grapplers.
    This is a good example of why my submission hunting is a little bit of a bad habit.
  5. franginho is offline

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    Feb 2013
    Location
    Brazil
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    252

    Posted On:
    4/19/2013 7:02am


     Style: JiuJistu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I wouldn't say submission hunting... I mean what ever you do, you make them move/react in a way that they expose themselves in one way or another and then you capitalize on it. While JJ and Judo tend to focus on doing this in a stabilized position/fashion other grappling arts, such as Sambo for instance, see the big focus on those transitions and how you can capitalize. It doesn't mean that one way is better than the other, it is just a different approach.
    Or to paint that point more drastically, is the guy who is submitting you from bottom/guard worse than the guy who gets you in his sidemount but then doesn't do anything with it? Different point of view...
  6. Krijgsman is online now

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    Posted On:
    4/19/2013 1:18pm


     Style: Judo noob, injured guy.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by franginho View Post
    I wouldn't say submission hunting... I mean what ever you do, you make them move/react in a way that they expose themselves in one way or another and then you capitalize on it. While JJ and Judo tend to focus on doing this in a stabilized position/fashion other grappling arts, such as Sambo for instance, see the big focus on those transitions and how you can capitalize. It doesn't mean that one way is better than the other, it is just a different approach.
    Or to paint that point more drastically, is the guy who is submitting you from bottom/guard worse than the guy who gets you in his sidemount but then doesn't do anything with it? Different point of view...
    Right. By submission hunting I am more talking about trying for submissions when you barely have control and ending up with neither position nor submission. I tend to do that. I think looking for subs is great (hence my bad habit) and creating them is even more impressive a skill, but position before submission (even if you only have full control of the position for a second of two before you go for the sub) seems to permeate all grappling arts to some degree.
  7. gregaquaman is online now
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    Senior Member

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    Arlie Beach
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    Posted On:
    4/19/2013 4:37pm


     Style: mma /boxing/muai thai

    2
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Add punching and those pins become a very real issue to contend with.
    Whitsunday Martial Arts Airlie Beach North Queensland.
    http://www.facebook.com/#!/WhitsundayMartialArts
  8. RynoGreene is offline

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    Seattle
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    Posted On:
    4/23/2013 3:11pm


     Style: FMA/SAMBO

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by gregaquaman View Post
    Add punching and those pins become a very real issue to contend with.
    Yah, this. In a combative/mma situation, just pound his face in if necessary. I frequently have a hand free when pinning, and with that hand I can punch conservatively and maintain my pin. Now those low power short punches might not mean much if I land just one, but if I can maintain the pin, I can land hundreds. Either beat the guy to a pulp, or let a few little shots set up a proper submission.
  9. DarkPhoenix is offline
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    I feel like you eyeballin' me, dawg!

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    Sep 2008
    Location
    Hicksville, NY
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    2,248

    Posted On:
    4/27/2013 7:20am

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, JJJ, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    One thing I found playing BJJ players (lower level players at least. I get my ass kicked by multi-stripe blues all the time) is that they don't know what to do when they are pinned. My favourite osaekomi is kesa gatame. Being a big fat ass, I normally put enough compression on my uke's chest that they tap because they can't breathe. If that doesn't work, I start working on an armbar while maintaining kesa.
    Quote Originally Posted by Holy Moment View Post
    BJJ JOE: I'm going to make hate to you. Right here, right now.
    ... Ohhhhhhhh, I'm going to make hate to you so hard that your kinfolk back in Africa will feel it.l
    Quote Originally Posted by Archer
    Karate is the Dane Cook of martial arts
  10. gregaquaman is online now
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    Senior Member

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    Arlie Beach
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    Posted On:
    4/28/2013 12:42am


     Style: mma /boxing/muai thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by RynoGreene View Post
    Yah, this. In a combative/mma situation, just pound his face in if necessary. I frequently have a hand free when pinning, and with that hand I can punch conservatively and maintain my pin. Now those low power short punches might not mean much if I land just one, but if I can maintain the pin, I can land hundreds. Either beat the guy to a pulp, or let a few little shots set up a proper submission.
    As a side note to that if the guy on the bottom cannot intelegently defend himself then you win. I a lower level mma he cant get his hands up to protect his face he is done.

    Quote Originally Posted by RynoGreene View Post
    Yah, this. In a combative/mma situation, just pound his face in if necessary. I frequently have a hand free when pinning, and with that hand I can punch conservatively and maintain my pin. Now those low power short punches might not mean much if I land just one, but if I can maintain the pin, I can land hundreds. Either beat the guy to a pulp, or let a few little shots set up a proper submission.
    As a side note to that if the guy on the bottom cannot intelegently defend himself then you win. I a lower level mma he cant get his hands up to protect his face he is done.
    Whitsunday Martial Arts Airlie Beach North Queensland.
    http://www.facebook.com/#!/WhitsundayMartialArts
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