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  1. patfromlogan is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/21/2013 11:40am

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Devil View Post
    If not giving a **** about the stuff that makes you **** dynamite makes me a troll, then yes. I'm a troll.
    yeah Devil it's a real problem that I care about my country and consider the war a horrid mistake. Removing Saddam actually had multiple reactons, many bad, and what good was done is overwhelmed by the negative. Pictures of marines throwing candy to Iraqi children does not negate the fact that this war was a monstrous war crime that was tantamount to mass murder by Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld... Yes I care and it's tragic that so few give a ****, isn't it?

    And like Vietnam we leave massive pollution - and I do put my money where my mouth is, we bought a large weaving made by Agent Orange victims recently. The legacy of Halliburton Dow Ortho Union Carbide, the collusion of corporations and war; how could you not care?


    http://www.alternet.org/world/falluj...ter812563&t=17
    Last edited by patfromlogan; 3/21/2013 11:56am at .
    "Preparing mentally, the most important thing is, if you aren't doing it for the love of it, then don't do it." - Benny Urquidez
  2. Devil is offline
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    His heart was visible, and the dismal sack that maketh excrement of what is eaten.

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    Posted On:
    3/21/2013 11:56am

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    Quote Originally Posted by patfromlogan View Post
    yeah Devil it's a real problem that I care about my country and consider the war a horrid mistake. Removing Saddam actually had multiple reactons, many bad, and what good was done is overwhelmed by the negative. Pictures of marines throwing candy to Iraqi children does not negate the fact that this war was a monstrous war crime that was tantamount to mass murder by Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld... Yes I care and it's tragic that so few give a ****, isn't it?
    Life is hard, Pat. It's not fair. You're not helping anyone by agonizing over every perceived injustice in the world. You're only making your own life miserable.

    Here's the way I look at it. I think I live a good life right now. I'm happy. My family is happy. That's what life is all about to me. Now, I'm a realist. I know there are a ton of things that could take that away in an instant. I do everything in my power to avoid such things. But I'll be damned if I'm going to ruin the good times by lamenting how bad things could be or how bad it may be for others.

    I'm not a crusader. I will wring every drop of enjoyment out of this short fucking life I possibly can. If you want to spend yours writhing in anger, go for it.
  3. ChenPengFi is online now
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    Posted On:
    3/21/2013 1:00pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Hung Gar, Choy Lay Fut

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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil View Post
    Anyway, I thought weed was supposed to make you calm. But apparently it turns people into paranoid lunatics.
    Well, there is this:
    Cannabis May Cause Schizophrenia-Like Brain Changes
    http://psychcentral.com/lib/2012/can...brain-changes/
  4. mike321 is online now

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    Posted On:
    3/21/2013 1:16pm


     Style: kenpo, Wrestling

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    Pat,

    What is this massive war crime that I keep hearing about related to initiating the Iraq War (second one in particular)? I have heard this referenced repeatedly. What is the specific international law cited? I am very confused over this? Why would Bush/Cheney be liable but congress exempt? Please clarify.

    Thanks
  5. patfromlogan is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/21/2013 1:27pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil View Post
    Life is hard, Pat. It's not fair. You're not helping anyone by agonizing over every perceived injustice in the world. You're only making your own life miserable.

    Here's the way I look at it. I think I live a good life right now. I'm happy. My family is happy. That's what life is all about to me. Now, I'm a realist. I know there are a ton of things that could take that away in an instant. I do everything in my power to avoid such things. But I'll be damned if I'm going to ruin the good times by lamenting how bad things could be or how bad it may be for others.

    I'm not a crusader. I will wring every drop of enjoyment out of this short fucking life I possibly can. If you want to spend yours writhing in anger, go for it.
    I don't spend time writhing in anger. In my real life my activism has been spent with some really great people, mostly faith led. I too have a family, long term relationships, no divorces, no drugs, drama kept to the minimum. That I care about the United States I see as a positive. In a democracy one gets what one deserves, and if you aren't involved you are part of the problem. And while I don't spend time getting all worked up (wait, I gotta be honest, I've had an lymph infection and getting blood pressure done a lot. Usually it's 130/75 or so but one time me and the nurse were talking about George Bush and it went to 195! So yes, it can get to me) I do spend time with family and friends, surfing and working out in martial arts, hiking The Big Island, working on the vacation rental (3 bedroom 2 bath in Puna, $100/day!) which means endless cleaning in the rainforest, mildew mold bugs etc, working some as an arborist pruning apples mostly, and

    That said I won't stop reading things like this, I got hip to the bullshit in Vietnam almost 50 years ago and enjoy knowing what is going on, and as usual the pros, the military and spies have realism, but the politicians and their corporate masters have an agenda:

    CIA and FBI Counter-Terrorism Officials: Cheney Lied About 9/11 Hijacker
    http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/...LeAYk.facebook

    http://readersupportednews.org/news-...on-on-iraq-war
    Last edited by patfromlogan; 3/21/2013 1:30pm at .
    "Preparing mentally, the most important thing is, if you aren't doing it for the love of it, then don't do it." - Benny Urquidez
  6. ChenPengFi is online now
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    Posted On:
    3/21/2013 1:41pm

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    --
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil View Post
    And you're just like a guy I work with who dropped dead in one of the office shitters last month. He was in his early 50s and let the stress kill him.
    Hell, i know an athlete who took the great care of himself and was the mellowest guy you'd ever meet.
    He died in his sleep last weekend.

    He didn't even make 50.
  7. patfromlogan is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/21/2013 1:54pm

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    --
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    Quote Originally Posted by mike321 View Post
    Pat,

    What is this massive war crime that I keep hearing about related to initiating the Iraq War (second one in particular)? I have heard this referenced repeatedly. What is the specific international law cited? I am very confused over this? Why would Bush/Cheney be liable but congress exempt? Please clarify.

    Thanks
    . Basically I think it's that lies and torture, under the US is subject to customary international law and to the Principles of Nuremberg Charter (and of course the justification of the war was largely from torture, google Suleiman Cheney and such for the gory details, torture got bs data that justified bs war) scares Cheney and Co. Pinochet's arrest set the modern precedent, eight years after he left office in Chile he was busted in London for numerous human rights violations.

    An international court in Malasia, five judges who've held various prestigious judicial positions in Malaysia, the U.K. and the U.S. found Cheney/Bush and Co guilty of conspiracy to commit torture. The results of the tribunal were sent to the Chief Prosecutor of the International Criminal Court, Hague, as well as the United Nations and the Security Council. And you can bet your sweet ass Cheney and Co. are watching this one!


    I like ex-Colin Powell aid Col. Lawrence Wilkerson a lot. Google his name and Cheney war crimes for more information. Wilkerson was known as the voice of Powell, things that Powell couldn't or wouldn't say Wilkerson said. His statements on the neo-cons are right on. And now he's come out on Cheney's paranoia about being busted for war crimes.
    "Preparing mentally, the most important thing is, if you aren't doing it for the love of it, then don't do it." - Benny Urquidez
  8. Devil is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/21/2013 2:01pm

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    --
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    Quote Originally Posted by patfromlogan View Post
    In a democracy one gets what one deserves, and if you aren't involved you are part of the problem.
    This is one of the fundamental differences between your personal philosophy and mine. In my estimation, our government is too far gone. People's bullshit activism is a waste of time and energy. I lost faith in the political process long ago. None of them represent me. The things that need to be fixed won't be fixed without bloodshed. I sincerely believe this. Still, I don't think we should hasten that bloodshed, because war - even if it results in much needed change, is painful. I don't want my children to experience that.

    But if the **** ever does break for real, I will be eager and ready to vote with fire early and often. I mean that.
  9. Devil is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/21/2013 2:01pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChenPengFi View Post
    Hell, i know an athlete who took the great care of himself and was the mellowest guy you'd ever meet.
    He died in his sleep last weekend.

    He didn't even make 50.
    Okay....
  10. bobyclumsyninja is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/21/2013 2:16pm

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     Style: Ex-Tiger KF, ex-SanDa

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Devil View Post
    I'm not a crusader. I will wring every drop of enjoyment out of this short fucking life I possibly can.
    Whatever world your (or anyone's kids) are left with doesn't matter a bit eh? Fuckem, amirite?

    Wouldn't want to let anything harsh your mellow. Fuckin hippie :)
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