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  1. Nid is offline

    Light Heavyweight

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
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    Posted On:
    4/29/2004 8:44am

    supporting member
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The point of it though, was that if you fight 2 minute intervals, you need to train cardio with similar intensity for 2 minute intervals to condition your heart and lungs to this type of exercise.

    You're talking about Fred Hatfield taking over Evander's conditioning routine. First thing he did was ditch the "aerobic base" nonsense.

    The heart and lungs only service that which actually does the work.

    Makes me think of Nicole Bass (the female bodybuilder) who comes on the Howard Stern show. She was in an exhibition boxing match with some other chick, and people were very critical of the bodybuilder who had no "aerobic" endurance....presumably because she's a "body builder", and people thought her performance was specific to her training (or lack thereof). *

    Regarding many people (like her...but not all) who are able to grow gigantic guns in the first place; that indicates that they have a relatively high proportion of the muscle fibers most prone to hypertrophy...and it just so happens that those are the kind least condusive to endurance. People put a great deal of the causation in the wrong place.

    Secondly, cardio is not a general body property. Literally, I've seen marathon runners get gassed in an step aerobics class. I've seen cyclists not able to swim 2 laps, etc. If the changes which yield improvements in these activities took place primarily at the level of the cardio system, one would expect a much more seemless transition between the various "cardio" exercises...cuz they're all cardio, right? Or substitute aerobic for cardio...it's all equally nebulous.

    *And yet, as a "body builder", I'm guessing she had a very high volume routine. Wouldn't that imply that she should have lots and lots of "strength endurance"? Or is it "endurance strength?" How many kinds of strength and endurance are there again?
    :rolleyes:
    Last edited by Nid; 4/29/2004 9:04am at .
  2. lechuza is offline

    Registered Member

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    Feb 2003
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    477

    Posted On:
    4/29/2004 9:19am


     Style: BJJ, No-Gi, MT

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Originally posted by Phrost
    Wing Chun punching drills... ugh. You won't build up big guns doing 30 minutes of chain punching or Tan Da, but you will be one wiry bastard who can punch non stop forever without gassing.
    Phrost,
    when you were doing those wing chun chain ppunching drills, were you doing them in the horse stance and were you varying the speed and power over that duration?

    At the school where i trained in "ving tsun" (Moyat--Richmond, VA) we did chain punching drills but I think we did some in the horse and some in a more relaxed stance.
  3. WhiteShark is offline
    WhiteShark's Avatar

    1% Shark is better than you.

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    Sep 2003
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    Atlanta GA
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    9,181

    Posted On:
    4/29/2004 9:29am

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: BJJ/Shidokan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Secondly, cardio is not a general body property. Literally, I've seen marathon runners get gassed in an step aerobics class. I've seen cyclists not able to swim 2 laps, etc. If the changes which yield improvements in these activities took place primarily at the level of the cardio system, one would expect a much more seemless transition between the various "cardio" exercises...cuz they're all cardio, right? Or substitute aerobic for cardio...it's all equally nebulous.
    Technically you are looking at the wrong stat to determine Aerobic fitness. The RECOVERY time is what those aerobic athlete will accel at regardless of the sport. They will gas simply because they aren't used to the exercise. But let that guy stop and time how long it takes his heartrate to return to rest. Then compare that to any other beginner, that's where the signifigant difference lies.
  4. Nid is offline

    Light Heavyweight

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    Oct 2003
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    Posted On:
    4/29/2004 9:45am

    supporting member
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    They will gas simply because they aren't used to the exercise. But let that guy stop and time how long it takes his heartrate to return to rest.

    Whatever the heart is doing is corrollary. In terms of external performance, does it really matter what the heart is doing so long as the muscle can perform the task? The heart is reactive, not pre-emptive.

    Charles Atlas, for instance, had a 2nd (and fatal) heart attack while running at 79. His *legs* seemed to work just fine *despite* the compromised heart.

    Semi-rhetorical question...what makes someone not used to any given exercise or activity?
    Last edited by Nid; 4/29/2004 9:56am at .
  5. Phrost is offline
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    19,098

    Posted On:
    4/29/2004 10:51am

    Business Class Supporting Memberstaff
     Guy Who Pays the Bills and Gets the Death Threats Style: MMA (Retired)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Originally posted by lechuza
    Phrost,
    when you were doing those wing chun chain ppunching drills, were you doing them in the horse stance and were you varying the speed and power over that duration?

    At the school where i trained in "ving tsun" (Moyat--Richmond, VA) we did chain punching drills but I think we did some in the horse and some in a more relaxed stance.
    We did them from the (and it's been a while, so I forget the name of it) stance you do the Siu Lim Tao and were encouraged to punch as hard as you could. A lot of the time, we'd have someone playing the lion dance drums as the cadence for the punches.
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