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  1. battlefields is online now
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    Posted On:
    1/17/2013 10:38pm

    forum leader
     Style: BJJ/ MMA/ MT

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Needer View Post
    What is with the step by step block text
    It helps address points in a coherent and relevant manner.
    sampling and deconstruction through insults?
    It is only insulting if you have insecurities, so you must have a lot of insecurities.
    How is that constructive?
    How is it not?
    I want to discuss techniques and principles
    Me too...
    and not character assassination.
    Nobody discussed character assassination. You assassinated your own character with your first post and you are still fighting that battle. Regarding above, did you mean that your first post was full of meaningless, childish, immature dribble, or that the thread was? Because if you meant the latter and still wonder why people would be antagonistic, well, **** you.
    You don't know me, so don't assume.
    You shouldn't assume that I am assuming anything. In fact, in order to not assume anything, I have purely responded to your posts, hence the quote blocks. That is why they are constructive.
    GET A RED BELT OR DIE TRYIN'.
  2. cualltaigh is online now
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    Posted On:
    1/17/2013 11:28pm


     Style: BJJ, MMA, JJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    See, now you've gone and confused him, Battlefields. He's from Inala, smaller words and slower sentences my friend.
    Dum spiro, spero.
    Tada gan iarracht.
  3. mike321 is online now

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    Posted On:
    1/17/2013 11:51pm


     Style: kenpo, Wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Back off MMA

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy
    Of course a karateka in the octagon would get his backside handed to him by an MMA fighter ... and probably on the street as well. But kicking someone's butt is not the ultimate goal of karate, its a Way.
    Or win a championship belt! Have you even bothered to check out the background of top mma fighters? Certain arts have higher representation and this leads to stereotypes. However, the top mma fighters are still coming from non mixed martial arts backgrounds. Training specifically for mma seems to be required but strangely enough people coming up as mma fighters do not dominate the top levels of the sport.
  4. mike321 is online now

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    Posted On:
    1/17/2013 11:59pm


     Style: kenpo, Wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Back off MMA

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy
    Of course a karateka in the octagon would get his backside handed to him by an MMA fighter ... and probably on the street as well. But kicking someone's butt is not the ultimate goal of karate, its a Way.
    Or win a championship belt! Have you even bothered to check out the background of top mma fighters? Certain arts have higher representation and this leads to stereotypes. However, the top mma fighters are still coming from non mixed martial arts backgrounds. Training specifically for mma seems to be required but strangely enough people coming up as mma fighters do not dominate the top levels of the sport.
  5. W. Rabbit is offline
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    There's not enough words to describe my existence.

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    Posted On:
    1/18/2013 12:34am

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     Style: No Style

    0
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Needer View Post
    This thread is almost necro'd so hopefully this will be my last contribution to this thread so I can move on to others.
    Are you insane?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Needer View Post
    not a fan of sparring keyboard warriors.
    Yet here you are.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Needer View Post
    You don't know me, so don't assume.
    Yet here you are.
    Last edited by W. Rabbit; 1/18/2013 12:39am at .
  6. Jimmy Needer is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/18/2013 1:54am


     Style: Karate, Muay Thai

    -2
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I cannot speak of all systems of karate but I can discuss Kyokushin and Shito Ryu Shukokai. From what I have seen, Kyokushin competitions are full contact knockdown but no punches to the face. It was impressive to watch those guys in the flesh a few times dish it out to each other. In their comps they would often invite opponents from other styles of martial arts - strikers that is. In the context of a bare knuckle full contact knock down elimination competition (but with no punching to the face or grappling) - from the few comps I went along to watch, other striking styles did not fair well ... Kyokushin ruled supreme, like I said - those guys can take a beating. However this is of course within the context of Kyokushin rules.

    Now the problem with the Kyokushin guys is sometimes they would get into a scrap at a local night club or pub. The one thing I noticed out of the few of those scraps I witnessed was that these guys would react in a real confrontation with a series of chest punches. Now this is obviously a generalisation, it is not to state that all Kyokushin fighters would react this way - however I remember thinking at the times when these scraps happened, that maybe these guys reacted this way because a lot of their free sparring involved lots of body work and very little head work.

    From what I experienced with Shito Ryu Shukokai - yes, there were lots of head punches but it is a points sports karate. We did lots of technique training, some impact training and virtually no contact training. I only got up to orange belt (goes red, yellow, orange etc) and I was in a beginner's class so my awareness of this style is probably not entirely accurate anyway. However from what I experienced - excellent refinement of technique and point scoring ... but very little contact.

    Yes, from the bashing I have received in my short time on Bullshido (just this thread), it seems clear so far that lots of people think karate is bullshit. I agree with some aspects of it being bullshit ... but in what context?

    You stated that the ultimate goal of 'the way' of martial arts is to kick butt. Perhaps for some martial arts but not necessarily for others. I joined Shito Ryu Shukokai because I am approaching middle age, I was slightly overweight and wanted to improve my health and fitness, flexibility, coordination, balance and self confidence. I needed stress release from the day to day grind. For me, karate was very effective in assisting me to reach these goals.

    I never joined traditional karate because I wanted kick someone's butt. I don't mind free sparring and semi contact competition - but I cringe at the idea of hurting another human being. I am not a 'tough' guy in that sense, never was, never will be.

    In my humble opinion karate will help you in many ways, including providing some BASIC self defense skills. Don't get me wrong, any realist knows that a black belt in karate won't mean much against a real tough guy or someone used to hard contact and can fight well on and off his feet.
  7. Jimmy Needer is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/18/2013 2:01am


     Style: Karate, Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by mike321 View Post
    Or win a championship belt! Have you even bothered to check out the background of top mma fighters? Certain arts have higher representation and this leads to stereotypes. However, the top mma fighters are still coming from non mixed martial arts backgrounds. Training specifically for mma seems to be required but strangely enough people coming up as mma fighters do not dominate the top levels of the sport.
    I have years of training in kickboxing and freestyle karate but that was 12 years ago. I only recently returned to these systems. I did a year of traditional karate in 2012. I remember watching the very early UFC but I have only recently started watching current MMA on cable. Still getting my head around the sport.
  8. Jimmy Needer is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/18/2013 2:02am


     Style: Karate, Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I am from Inala Waters, not Inala.
  9. Jimmy Needer is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/18/2013 2:34am


     Style: Karate, Muay Thai

    -2
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Insecure? Sure I am insecure, who isn't? Its the nature of the human condition.

    I found some real good in learning traditional karate - it led to weight loss, improved self confidence, health, fitness and mental well being. It also helped to improve my linear punching considerably. This is the emphasis I took with my initial post. I feel confident in stating that because in my earlier years I trained in kickboxing, freestyle karate and boxing. 'I' notice the difference and that's all that matters.

    If I could go back and rewrite that first post, I would leave out all the bravado - but no amount of digital bashing is going to change what I have personally experienced. Just trying to share those experiences in defense of all the good I gathered from training in traditional karate.

    I am not a tough guy, I am just some guy. I am not interested in cracking heads, I don't want to hurt anyone for real. It is not who I am and I hope it is not what most people are either. I like a watching a biff - but in a sports context and between two athletes. I am interested in the other aspects of martial arts training ... most of which I have already mentioned.

    I have now left traditional karate and I have returned to my grass roots styles of a form of Freestyle Goju and also Muay Thai. Yes, in your words this is indeed 'flip flopping'... I'll admit it.

    I started this thread because I was at a point of cognitive dissonance. Traditional karate gave me so much, but I need some other elements - we did pad work but I needed more pad work. Some techniques were realistic but I needed the techniques to be as realistic as possible. Above all else I missed how I originally trained.

    I will also admit that I had issues with traditional karate which is why I have changed styles - however I still hold fast to the key principles of what I stated in my first post.

    * Traditional Karate is not complete bullshit - it taught me to punch better than other styles.
    * MMA would beat karate in an MMA competition (and most likely in the street as well - but that would depend on the individuals, wouldn't it?).
    * Real fights end quickly - reverse punch with your strongest arm is instinctively one of the first weapons of choice ... therefore traditional karate and its emphasis on strong linear reverse punches has some realistic value.
    * Should avoid real violence - not the karateka nor the right thing to do, that's why we have laws.

    These are my points, these are still my points ... I am just another slightly overweight insecure middle aged nerd trying to make a point, that's all. But I am not insecure enough to not admit it. Go ahead, tear it apart if you like, someone surely will.
  10. cualltaigh is online now
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    Posted On:
    1/18/2013 2:41am


     Style: BJJ, MMA, JJJ

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Needer View Post
    I am from Inala Waters, not Inala.
    LOL, how remiss of me not to make that distinction....
    Dum spiro, spero.
    Tada gan iarracht.

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