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  1. adskibullus is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/20/2012 2:59pm


     Style: Lifting heavy stuff

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    starting out lifting, bulk or cut?

    Im sorry for the long post but i have a few questions and searching here on bullshido and on the net bring up various conflicting opinions, here goes.

    Due to random working hours ive had to put judo on the back burner for the foreseable future but one thing ive been meaning to do and have finally got the chance to do is weight lifting.

    Ive managed to pick up a decent set of second hand dumbells, barbell and weight plates and have a garage do the training in. As for routine ive started for the past month doing Squats, deadlifts, bent over rows, military press and bench press all 10 reps and 4 sets 3 times a week similar to stronglifts 5x5.

    Now a little bit about me and my goals im 6 ft 2 and have a BMI of 25 ( recently been checked by a doctor) the doctor says im slightly overweight but they're not concered about it but it not what i want. im skinny fat with a belly but skinny arms and legs but quite wide shoulders. My goals are to gain some muscle mass and lose the belly.

    Here comes the catch,If im correct you need surplus calories to build muscle, this usually entails gaining extra fat. But i dont really want anymore belly fat and from what i understand is that you cant lose weight and gain muscle at the same time, is this true? Although i dont want to cut weight and lose the precious muscle i already have.

    Is bulking and cutting the best method to try and if it is what should i do first bulk and cut the fat later or cut down and bulk up but this stupid as ill just be putting fat back on? Im not particulary worried about strength although it would be a nice side effect im looking to change my body shape from skinny fat to more muscular and trim.

    help please....
  2. Mister is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/20/2012 3:17pm


     Style: Injured

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    So...a little clarification.

    You weigh 195lb and are 6'2 tall.

    And, you want to start bodybuilding.

    Correct?
  3. adskibullus is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/20/2012 3:33pm


     Style: Lifting heavy stuff

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Correct, sorry if the op was a bit of a ramble.
  4. Mister is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/20/2012 5:00pm


     Style: Injured

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'd say bulk up. No sense in cutting then bulking.

    Getting a personal trainer (if you can afford one) to teach you how to do the basic lifts is a good start that will actually save you a lot of time.

    If you want a beginner's program that is well suited for your goals take a look at this. http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/we...am-411592.html

    I wouldn't recommend following your own program I would recommend RELIGIOUSLY sticking to one program designed by someone who knows their **** and if any doubts should arise know that they've visited many before you and that they don't matter.

    I don't want to talk out of my ass so I won't talk about nutrition.
  5. TheRuss is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/20/2012 11:38pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: None

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Lift heavy things. Eat good food. Sleep deeply. Repeat.
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    Downstreet on the flip-flop, timepants.
  6. erezb is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/21/2012 6:06am


     Style: Boxing,Kickboxing K1

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What Russ said, only i'll add lift properly. Do you have any experience with the lifts you described? You can do damage to yourself if you start adding weight to your lifts while doing them wrong.
    Even a couple of personal training sessions can make the difference, if all he does is teach you how to lift, and show you some great exercises.
    About the bulking before dieting thing. I would suggest you change your diet a bit, not for cutting weight but also not eating like a bear. Clean your diet (always good), add fresh foods on a daily basis (vegis and fruits) switch to dark bread (rich in fiber).
    The only thing to increase if you want to gain some lean muscle mass are proteins. The easiest way is buying a low carb protein shake, and drink it after training sessions.
    Also add some running to your training program, it is a great whole body exercise.
  7. Diesel_tke is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/21/2012 11:51am

    supporting member
     Style: stick,Taiji, mountainbike

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by adskibullus View Post
    Ive managed to pick up a decent set of second hand dumbells, barbell and weight plates and have a garage do the training in. As for routine ive started for the past month doing Squats, deadlifts, bent over rows, military press and bench press all 10 reps and 4 sets 3 times a week similar to stronglifts 5x5.
    Your off to a good start. Keep this up, and don't over think the thing. Biggest issue you will run into is patients. Put the work in, and the results will come.

    The other thing you should do, which helped me a lot, was to keep measurements. I have a running log where I measured my chest at the niples, bicepts, stomach, quads, calves, and neck. I did new measurements every month. Oh, and body weight. I can go back years on my log and track progress. It really helps because you don't notice the difference looking in the mirror every day.

    Once you start a program, don't adjust anything in it for about 3 months. Just keep on it. It takes a while to get the results.
    Combatives training log.

    Gezere: paraphrase from Bas Rutten, Never escalate the level of violence in fight you are losing. :D

    Drum thread

    Pavel Tsatsouline: kettlebell workouts give you “cardio without the dishonour of aerobics”.
  8. adskibullus is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/21/2012 6:32pm


     Style: Lifting heavy stuff

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thanks for the replays everyone. As it stands I've had no instruction on how to preform the lifts I've just watched video's and started with light weights hopfully this is enough? I don't have a power rack but I intend to either make or buy one soon in the new year to help prevent injury. I have been reading a lot and many people are saying that the squat can be quite a dangerous lift and a few of my friends who train turn their nose up at the idea of barbell squats as they use machines and say barbell squats are dangerous, how much truth is in this?

    If back squats are dangerous are there any other exercise that can be done with free weights that are less dangerous but still work the legs? I'm thinking dumbell lunges maybe?

    Also would you recommend some light cardio twice a weeks aswell just to keep the fitness side up or will making the lifting more intense i.e shorter rests between sets be enough cardio wise? I want to keep a decent base level of fitness so if my working hours get better i can get back into judo without gassing like a mo fo.

    Cheers
  9. Magpie McGee is online now

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    Posted On:
    12/21/2012 6:57pm


     Style: Thai Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    No. Squatting is important. Unless you have a chronic injury to work around, there's no reason not to squat. Your friends are babies. Obviously putting a heaving thing on your back and standing up can be dangerous if you do it wrong, but it isn't an extremely difficult motion to learn to do correctly.

    If you're really concerned, start light and gradually ramp up the weight every session. Your progress may be a little slower at first, but it's worth it to get the exercise right.

    Also, no dumbbell lunges are not the same.

    For cardio. If you want to do cardio, then do it. Don't tamper with the rest periods between sets. They're there for a reason.

    I'll leave it at that, because I don't want to give you too much unverified broscience. Maybe someone better at this than me can answer that more effectively.
  10. Mister is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/21/2012 7:28pm


     Style: Injured

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There is some truth to the squat being dangerous. Because it's often done incorrectly.

    It's a great investment to get a coach if you can afford it.

    If you don't get a coach you'll have to read and watch a LOT of videos and be really attentive.

    Elbows up, big breath into belly, push abs out, tight lower back, sit back, knees out, squat below parallel, drive up out of the hole with hips not chest...etc.

    You have to think about these cues (among others) WHILE squatting low-bar.

    If you just go through the motions everytime and the weight gets heavy you might get injured.

    You can also post form checks online and have them picked apart.

    It's better if you do but you don't HAVE to squat if your main goal is to look good.

    A lot of people will tell you no cardio if you're bulking for the gains.

    But, cardio is essential for a fighter, you have to weigh that.

    I hope this answers your questions.
    Last edited by Mister; 12/21/2012 7:40pm at .

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