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  1. Sam Browning is online now

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    Posted On:
    12/13/2012 8:24pm

    hall of famestaff
     

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Okay, I stand corrected, it was not a verbal statement. Son of Rex made a post here on Bullshido. Now the next question is whether, the original poster has contacted Rickson and asked if Rice is a student of his. Similarly the OP might ask us to try and get Son of Rex back here, to clarify his earlier statements. Then if anything remained unresolved, Rice could be recontacted.
  2. itwasntme is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/13/2012 8:55pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Re: MABS Investigations

    Quote Originally Posted by Sam Browning View Post
    Okay, I stand corrected, it was not a verbal statement. Son of Rex made a post here on Bullshido. Now the next question is whether, the original poster has contacted Rickson and asked if Rice is a student of his. Similarly the OP might ask us to try and get Son of Rex back here, to clarify his earlier statements. Then if anything remained unresolved, Rice could be recontacted.
    I spent so much time researching Kalintaw I didn't even think about contacting Rickson. I'll get on that when I get back home.
    Start a training log!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ming Loyalist View Post
    i really think that those who can't get their head around the bowing thing (because their angry sky daddy will punish them) don't deserve judo. life is full of choices, and if your bronze age superstitions are holding you back, so be it.
  3. itwasntme is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/13/2012 9:17pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Re: MABS Investigations

    Quote Originally Posted by Mister View Post
    Holy **** man. You share too much.

    These guys have the upper hand on you when bickering because of that.

    What you don't think any of them have erectile disfunctions or their wife left them for another woman? Or they gambled away all their savings? Or they got fired from their jobs for being incompetent? Or lost their kid in the subway? Or even all of the above?

    They know about your failures so they can use them against you, you don't know about theirs.

    Stay anonymous man this is the internet, you ain't gonna get much useful advice if you post your story here anyway. Try maybe asking your friends or family.

    You're just going to find a lot of piss-taking and distasteful comments online.

    I guess what I'm trying to say is: Be cool and be careful what you say.

    Noone's better than you although they make it seem like the case.

    ...And you seem to be buying it.

    Everyone has their insecurities and their mistakes.

    Everyone here just happens to know about yours.

    Just be cool man.

    I know that was a long time ago but **** I noticed that everytime you bicker with someone or similar you get this **** back in your face.

    Very...dishonorable. To bring someones failures to their face at every opportunity.

    I guess this is offtopic but we're in trollshido anyway.

    Good luck with your investigation man I hope your questions are answered.
    While I appreciate this, I know bro. I don't take what they say to heart, I just try to outfunny them. I'm obviously not always successful.

    Thanks on the investigation part. I don't understand why there can't be a writeup if someone turns out to be legit and has outstanding claims like Larry's. But we will see.
    Start a training log!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ming Loyalist View Post
    i really think that those who can't get their head around the bowing thing (because their angry sky daddy will punish them) don't deserve judo. life is full of choices, and if your bronze age superstitions are holding you back, so be it.
  4. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/13/2012 10:45pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mister View Post
    I will be cute and Redundant because I think itwasntme is extremely new.
    So, how many posts and threads do you need?

    Quote Originally Posted by itwasntme View Post
    Thanks on the investigation part. I don't understand why there can't be a writeup if someone turns out to be legit and has outstanding claims like Larry's. But we will see.
    This is why you get ****! How many write ups, fitting your parameters, do you need? Why do you think this hasn't happened?
  5. itwasntme is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/13/2012 11:30pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by dougguod View Post
    " I'm pretty sure SoR and/or Larry's wife manage his site", " I felt it was implied", " I took that to mean"," I seem to recall"... this is some of the vaguest nonsense I've ever read on Bullshido. Dude, you've got nothing more than supposed statements from an alleged student and have apparently made no effort to get straight answers from the man himself (and no, sending Sifu Rice an email to let him know you've already called him out is NOT due diligence). This isn't just a witch hunt, it's an incompetent one.
    Suppose I gave my name and said Larry told me these about who runs his website. Suppose I could produce photos of other Americans stating they too have trained under Galo. It's still my word against his.

    Besides, is all that really necessary right now? We haven't even heard from Larry or anyone that knows him/trains under him. You're complaining about a chance to learn something about a martial art on a website all about debunking fraud and compiling facts.

    Edit: By the way, I know exactly who SoR is. Larry and I spoke about him when I met with him. I knew who he was from the things he put on his profile here and what he told me in class.
  6. dougguod is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/14/2012 12:39am


     

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Suppose, suppose. Suppose itwasntme has a basement full of dead Cub Scouts and a meth lab in his garage. Hypotheticals are all it takes to indict someone in your world?

    Neither Larry nor anyone that knows him/trains under him is under any obligation to respond. This is particularly true when there is no indication that he has done anything that needs to be responded to and when queries are made in a heavy-handed and obnoxious manner. Frankly, were I in Mr. Rice's place I'd ignore you too.

    If you're still in touch with SoR get him here to offer direct testimony. It will have more credibility than your hazy hearsay.
  7. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/14/2012 1:07am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Oh wow, when was this moved to YMAS? Uh oh, merger time.

    Quote Originally Posted by dougguod View Post
    If you're still in touch with SoR get him here to offer direct testimony. It will have more credibility than your hazy hearsay.
    This was addressed in another thread and he didn't listen because CPF, Rivington and I are biased. Trust me, I do get the irony in his conclusion.
  8. ChuckWepner is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/14/2012 8:22am


     

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by itwasntme View Post
    Besides, is all that really necessary right now? We haven't even heard from Larry or anyone that knows him/trains under him. You're complaining about a chance to learn something about a martial art on a website all about debunking fraud and compiling facts.
    Just to clarify where things stand, itwasntme, will you please respond to the following? I've put asterisks and a number at each point where I have a question that I hope may help focus discussion.

    At this point the issues not resolved by correcting misreading / misunderstanding, etc., that I can identify that you feel there is reason to pursue are:

    Did Larry Rice study Brazilian Jiu Jitsu under Rickson Gracie?
    Does Larry Rice have an impressive fight record?

    *1 Are there others remaining?*

    I gather that the reason to think that Mr. Rice may have claimed these things is that a student of Mr. Rice's posted here that Mr. Rice studied BJJ under Rickson Gracie and also that Mr. Rice had an impressive fight record and had told him not to brag about it.

    As of now, there has been no other evidence offered that Mr. Rice claimed these things and no evidence offered either way about whether Mr. Rice has ever trained with Rickson Gracie or about what his fight record may be.

    *2 Is there other relevant evidence at this point of any fraud / dishonesty by Mr. Rice to be considered?*

    There is no claim on Mr. Rice's website that he ever studied BJJ with anyone. This is despite the fact that he has a very extensive MA biography and names a large number of people under whom he has trained (including continuing training). He does not list BJJ among the five disciplines currently taught in classes at his academy, nor even among the larger group of nine in which he offers instruction.

    Mr. Rice does list Ju Jitsu (a common, if a bit old-fashioned, variant spelling for JJJ) as something that he teaches. He also reports holding a black belt in Ju Jitsu received under Carl Wilcox (an 8th Dan Black Belt and Vice-President of the United States Ju-Jitsu Federation; note the spelling used by the organization, further confirming that this -- JJJ -- is what Mr Rice means when he refers to "Ju Jitsu").

    I assume that Mr. Wilcox was one of those you contacted during your earlier investigation and that Mr. Wilcox confirmed Mr. Rice's jujutsu bona fides.

    *3 Is that correct?*

    So, Mr. Rice's Web page does not confirm the report that Mr. Rice claims expertise in BJJ at all, let alone that he claims expertise that he lacks in order to defraud people or enhance his professional standing.

    Regarding his fight record, the only comment on his website is: "But most important, Sifu Rice was Ring Tested, participating in hundreds of fights in a dozen martial arts, mano a mano." This is an impressive claim, though "fights" is possibly ambiguous, but we are talking about someone who has earned several black belts in different martial arts, as your calls confirmed, so it is well within the realm of possibility for someone with 30 years in MA.

    *4 During your conversations with Mr. Rice, did you ask him about his BJJ training or teaching (if any)?*

    *5 Did you ask him about what kinds of fights he has participated in or any other questions about his fight record?*

    *6 Do you have any more information about either of these or other remaining topics of concern that would clarify what specifically it is that you think requires further investigation?*
  9. itwasntme is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/14/2012 9:11am

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    Re: Sifu Rice At A Glance

    Quote Originally Posted by ChuckWepner View Post
    Just to clarify where things stand, itwasntme, will you please respond to the following? I've put asterisks and a number at each point where I have a question that I hope may help focus discussion.
    Certainly.

    At this point the issues not resolved by correcting misreading / misunderstanding, etc., that I can identify that you feel there is reason to pursue are:

    Did Larry Rice study Brazilian Jiu Jitsu under Rickson Gracie?
    Does Larry Rice have an impressive fight record?
    Yes, I believe so. I have tried to contact Galo, so unless I were to hear from him those questions would likely be the only things that could add information to this.

    *1 Are there others remaining?*
    Nothing I can think of at the moment. I was unable to find any information about his instructor, Vic Payne, so I don't know if any of those certs would be questionable or not.

    There is only one issue I can think of that I didn't mention because it seemed to just be a semantic argument. He calls himself an "Associate Instructor" under Bobby Taboada. When I contacted Taboada's webmaster about this I was told:

    1. "Associate Instructor" is a title of Larry's own invention.
    2. Larry is permitted to teach up to what he knows under Taboada's system.
    3. You are not considered any type of instructor in his system until you reach Level 6 or Level 7, which Larry is not.

    I gather that the reason to think that Mr. Rice may have claimed these things is that a student of Mr. Rice's posted here that Mr. Rice studied BJJ under Rickson Gracie and also that Mr. Rice had an impressive fight record and had told him not to brag about it.

    As of now, there has been no other evidence offered that Mr. Rice claimed these things and no evidence offered either way about whether Mr. Rice has ever trained with Rickson Gracie or about what his fight record may be.
    Correct. The only thing I have been able to find about Larry's fights are on his website where I believe he vaguely mentions 'hundreds of fights throughout his life' or something to that effect. I just woke up, so I will get an exact quote in a bit.

    *2 Is there other relevant evidence at this point of any fraud / dishonesty by Mr. Rice to be considered?*
    I don't believe so. Keep in mind an investigation isn't any less valuable because a "fraud" is not uncovered.

    There is no claim on Mr. Rice's website that he ever studied BJJ with anyone. This is despite the fact that he has a very extensive MA biography and names a large number of people under whom he has trained (including continuing training). He does not list BJJ among the five disciplines currently taught in classes at his academy, nor even among the larger group of nine in which he offers instruction.

    Mr. Rice does list Ju Jitsu (a common, if a bit old-fashioned, variant spelling for JJJ) as something that he teaches. He also reports holding a black belt in Ju Jitsu received under Carl Wilcox (an 8th Dan Black Belt and Vice-President of the United States Ju-Jitsu Federation; note the spelling used by the organization, further confirming that this -- JJJ -- is what Mr Rice means when he refers to "Ju Jitsu").

    I assume that Mr. Wilcox was one of those you contacted during your earlier investigation and that Mr. Wilcox confirmed Mr. Rice's jujutsu bona fides.

    *3 Is that correct?*
    We are talking about the late Hanshi Carl D Wilcox here, so unfortunately I am unable to speak with him.

    I couldn't find mention of Larry on the USJJF site, but that doesn't mean it's not there. I didn't know how else to pursue this.

    So, Mr. Rice's Web page does not confirm the report that Mr. Rice claims expertise in BJJ at all, let alone that he claims expertise that he lacks in order to defraud people or enhance his professional standing.
    As it stands, this is correct.

    I was too tired last night, but this morning I'm looking into the Rickson claim like Sam Browning said to do. I haven't found a direct method of contact yet, but I did find a site with belt holders where Larry's name is not mentioned.

    http://www.gracieacademy.com/belt_holders_rank.asp

    Regarding his fight record, the only comment on his website is: "But most important, Sifu Rice was Ring Tested, participating in hundreds of fights in a dozen martial arts, mano a mano." This is an impressive claim, though "fights" is possibly ambiguous, but we are talking about someone who has earned several black belts in different martial arts, as your calls confirmed, so it is well within the realm of possibility for someone with 30 years in MA.
    I agree that this claim could be well within reason for someone that has been "in the game" for so long. Also, this is the quote I was speaking about earlier in my response.

    I was asking for clarification on this point because it seems vague and something people were asking about when SoR brought it up. It was also brought up that there should be some kind of records of these fights.

    *4 During your conversations with Mr. Rice, did you ask him about his BJJ training or teaching (if any)?*

    *5 Did you ask him about what kinds of fights he has participated in or any other questions about his fight record?*
    The apology was our only real conversation. When he found out I was checking with his instructors he seemed to me to be mad. He hurriedly gave me the contact of a couple instructors, not referring to them by title as he asked us to do in class, and then ceased contact with me. This all happened in the course of about a week. I wanted to ask him, but I didn't think directly after the apology was the best way to get answers, then I lost my chance.

    *6 Do you have any more information about either of these or other remaining topics of concern that would clarify what specifically it is that you think requires further investigation?*
    I think right now that is all.
    Start a training log!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ming Loyalist View Post
    i really think that those who can't get their head around the bowing thing (because their angry sky daddy will punish them) don't deserve judo. life is full of choices, and if your bronze age superstitions are holding you back, so be it.
  10. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/14/2012 9:23am

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    Quote Originally Posted by itwasntme View Post


    The apology was our only real conversation. When he found out I was checking with his instructors he seemed to me to be mad. He hurriedly gave me the contact of a couple instructors, not referring to them by title as he asked us to do in class, and then ceased contact with me. This all happened in the course of about a week. I wanted to ask him, but I didn't think directly after the apology was the best way to get answers, then I lost my chance.
    DO, I really need to explain this to you? No, you don't get it because this is your third culpability spin attempt.

    Chuck, you need to read itwasntme's other threads. He is missing a HUGE issue that he keeps spinning in his favor.
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