Should we still teach Japanese in the dojo?

[Devil]

When I started Ju-Jitsu I really enjoyed not just doing the physical part but learning the history and language it made it more than just a martial art for me and I think if classes just focus on the physical we will eventually lose the History.

You're a Japanophile. I'm not knocking you for that, but understand it doesn't make you a better martial artist. It's just language. And history can be learned in any language. The idea that you have to count in Japanese to learn the history of martial arts is just an excuse to indulge your Japanophilia.

I think the importance of history in martial arts training is a completely separate discussion. But regardless of where you stand on the importance of history - it can be learned in any language.

[JPhoenix]

When I started Ju-Jitsu I really enjoyed not just doing the physical part but learning the history and language it made it more than just a martial art for me and I think if classes just focus on the physical we will eventually lose the History.

I can agree with liking it as more than a martial art. Some people want more than that and there is nothing wrong with that. I am worried how accurate the history is. Many times I've heard highly inaccurate historical details. If the teacher really studies the history and lets students know that part of their time will be spent learning history instead of training, I would have no problem with them teaching it.

[judojeff]

I like learning the "official" names of moves is that it makes it easier to consistently transfer knowledge from one school or style to the next.

This is a good point, having a standard name for moves seriously cuts down on possible confusion between schools. Being able to go to most any judo school and have a common vocabulary is a huge bonus. But that common vocab could be in any language and we would not lose the history of judo, the founder and historical figures would not change if we all decided to use german instead of japanese.

If the history and the philosophical aspects of an art interest you that's all well and good but changing a fairly minor aspect of the art (names of moves) will not take away those aspects.

[Vieux Normand]

Nein.

Absolutely no Japanese should be taught in anyplace calling itself a

DOJO.

No irony whatsoever. None.

[Rivington]

Similar issues come up in CMA. What is the English word for peng? "Ward off" is a typical translation, but that obscures as much as it illuminates. A bit of practice and a number of explanations are required to "get it", but once gotten a taiji player can go anywhere in the world and get what people mean by peng.

[judojeff]

Mildly off topic question for the sambo guys on the forum, do you/your teachers use russian names for techniques?

[jdempsey]

I also think expecting young children to learn Japanese nomenclature is unhelpfull and distracting

I studied jjj as a kid and i can attest to this ^^^. The terminology was confusing distracting and definitely unhelpful. Frustrating and off putting too seeing no talent kids grading ahead of me because I couldn't grasp the language.

[Bondy8]

You're a Japanophile. I'm not knocking you for that, but understand it doesn't make you a better martial artist. It's just language. And history can be learned in any language. The idea that you have to count in Japanese to learn the history of martial arts is just an excuse to indulge your Japanophilia.

I think the importance of history in martial arts training is a completely separate discussion. But regardless of where you stand on the importance of history - it can be learned in any language.

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I have the privilege to train with some great instructors in the BJJAGB and I really enjoy every aspect of Ju-jitsu from the katas to using all the traditional weapons,I also like the history of where they came from, I know that learning the language and history doesn't make you a better Martial artist but it gives you an insight into how some of the techniques worked back in the day

[Devil]

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I know that learning the language and history doesn't make you a better Martial artist but it gives you an insight into how some of the techniques worked back in the day

Which is necessary why? Boxing originates from ancient Greece. Do you need to study Ancient Greek to throw a jab? No.

It's fun to you. You like it. That's where the need to use Japanese terminology begins and ends. Don't stretch for further reasoning.

And if you want to argue the value of using the terminology, defend your original position that breaking from tradition will result in the loss of honor, discipline and respect. Japanese words make you a better martial artist. That's exactly what you were implying in your original post. Don't backpedal.

[Petter]

I enjoy learning the terminology of judo. I also appreciate the fact that much of it is very systematic and is not merely more precise than generic terms like "hip throw" (which one?), but also fits together in a logical system so that, with a few stems like o/ko, uchi/soto, harai/kari/nage, &c., it's easy and logical to learn terminology for new techniques. I value the fact that some of the words even provide clues to proper principles (e.g. harai, kari, otoshi).

I don't for a moment imagine that I couldn't learn the same physical movements and applications without that terminology, though; and although I enjoy the fact that these terms are in Japanese, the same pragmatic values could presumably be found in an English-language terminology system if it were equally systematic. (And, well, lots of judo terminology obviously isn't. Ouchi gari -- got it. Yama arashi -- huh?)