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  1. blackmonk is offline
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    Welterweight

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    Posted On:
    11/19/2012 5:04pm

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     Style: belt and jacket wrestling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Re: defending butterfly guard pass

    They don't really have upper body control so much as they have my hips pinned between their elbows and knees.

    The stfu n00b answer would be to not let them pin my hips, but I'm looking for what to do when they've pinned my hips, shucked a hook, and are now passing.
  2. blackmonk is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/19/2012 6:41pm

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     Style: belt and jacket wrestling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Petter View Post
    This pass?

    In general terms, Id probably do one of two things. Supposing it is my right leg that gets stuck, and my opponent is trying to circle/pass to my right (his left). I might try to use my free (left) leg to reach over and trap his nearest (right) leg by stepping over it, then angle onto my right hip a bit and wiggle the trapped hook free, then play half butterfly from there. Alternatively, I might post my free (left) foot on his hip and try to push off, create a bit of space so I have some room to play with, maybe replacing butterfly, maybe moving to something else.
    That's essentially it, minus the underhook on the leg. The action with the feet/knees is the same.
  3. BKR is offline
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    My dog is cuter and smarter than yours.

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    Posted On:
    11/19/2012 6:49pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kodokan Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    They don't really have upper body control so much as they have my hips pinned between their elbows and knees.

    The stfu n00b answer would be to not let them pin my hips, but I'm looking for what to do when they've pinned my hips, shucked a hook, and are now passing.
    How to they pin your hips in the first place.

    I'm going to give a general answer. I find that a lot of people, especially beginners, tend to get married to a certain "guard" configuration and will stay in it no matter what. That can be instructive for sure, however, in general, it also works to be able to transition positions (guard or otherwise) to counter whatever your partner is attempting to do.

    I'll leave it there.

    Ben
    Falling for Judo since 1980
  4. Mr.Miyagi is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/19/2012 7:48pm


     Style: BJJ/Zumba

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Kintanon View Post
    Are they controlling your upper body so much that you can't use the hook that is still established as well as your now free leg to push your hips backwards and re-insert your hook?

    Alternately you can perform an armdrag on the same side as your free leg.

    The deciding issue on how you can counter that pass is going to be what kind of upper body control they have over you.
    I'm pretty much agreeing with this.

    I know in the later video of the pass it shows the foot being stuck higher up (not in a hook position), but you should be trying to hip escape back to make space and straighten back up to stop the pass and re-align with them, either go back to hooks/butterfly guard or close etc.

    Hip out, re-align (to negate/reverse the angle he's trying to pass on to that side of the trapped leg, get yo' guard back.
    Daniel: I don't know if I know enough karate.

    Miyagi: Feeling correct.

    Daniel: You sure know how to make a guy feel confident.

    Miyagi: You trust the quality of what you know, not quantity.
  5. danno is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/19/2012 7:50pm

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     Style: BJJ

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    Quote Originally Posted by David Koresh Jr. View Post
    They kill your butterfly hooks like that typically because they can get you flat. If that's your concern I'd say frame under their neck with your (left arm if they trapped your right hook) rock up onto your (right) elbow and scoot your hips back.
    This one. Push their head to the side they're passing, regain guard or scramble or whatever. Framing as above is good. I'll often just palm the side of the head and straighten my arm to get maximum distance.

    Imagine the alignment of you and your opponent's spine. When he's in your guard, they're both aligned. When he's passed, they're at 90 degrees. Start pushing the head away before you are at 45 degrees to each other. After that point it's too late. Try to stay aligned.

    Hope that makes sense, communicating this **** in text is hard.
  6. blackmonk is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/19/2012 10:47pm

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     Style: belt and jacket wrestling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by danno View Post
    This one. Push their head to the side they're passing, regain guard or scramble or whatever. Framing as above is good. I'll often just palm the side of the head and straighten my arm to get maximum distance.
    Yes, this is usually my go-to. I'll work on it some more.

    I rolled for a couple of hours tonight, and when I felt people going for it, I just postured up and did some pretty aggressive grip fighting. Didn't lose that battle tonight, but tomorrow is a different day.
  7. Kintanon is offline
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    Yes, I am smarter than you are.

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    Posted On:
    11/20/2012 10:07am

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     Style: TKD, BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmonk View Post
    They don't really have upper body control so much as they have my hips pinned between their elbows and knees.

    The stfu n00b answer would be to not let them pin my hips, but I'm looking for what to do when they've pinned my hips, shucked a hook, and are now passing.

    Ok, to trap your hips between their elbows and knees they have to be pretty low down on your body, leaving your upper body free to move. So take advantage of that. Sit up and go for a guillotine. Attack so that their head is on the same side they are trying to pass to, and kick the leg that is not trapped over their back. That will give them something else to worry about besides passing your guard because continuing the pass will just get them choked more if you have the grip.
    Even if you DON'T have the grip solid, as they continue to pass you turn towards them and come up to your knees and you can tackle them over or take the back, or just end up re-guarding if you don't feel like you can pull this off.

    OR, if you don't like the idea of going for a submission there then just sit up and dig for underhooks like there's no tomorrow. Either way, getting your back off the mat is going to be the key concept here. Get your upper body UP so that you can use your arms to attack and push them around.
  8. goodlun is online now
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    Posted On:
    11/20/2012 4:38pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Can we get a video of how to beat this?
  9. blackmonk is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/20/2012 10:02pm

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     Style: belt and jacket wrestling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm gonna try to make a video tomorrow, since jnp and some other bullies will be at the gym. Maybe we can come up with something.
  10. DKJr is offline
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    Fasten your seat belts, and prepare for lift off

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    Posted On:
    11/20/2012 11:08pm

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     Style: Combat Cuddling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by goodlun View Post
    Can we get a video of how to beat this?
    I'll make my take on it tomorrow as well.
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