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  1. erezb is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/06/2012 8:59am


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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    Read his initial post. It is true because he said magically. That's sarcasm and he is saying that a college degree doesn't guarantee you a job in America. Yes, even if you go to one of the top 10 Business colleges.
    Again, you are as pointless as an albino chita. I said finish top ten in a top ten business school. And yes it will lend you a fucking job immediately, just like if you finished Harvard medical school, you are going to find a job. Getting and finishing those programs is all you need to show you are very capable.Excelling one of those ivy league schools is so fucking hard, that immediately you know you have an extremely competent guy in-front of you, Also starting salaries are very high.
    http://www.businessweek.com/stories/...nancial-advice
    The starting median salary for a Yale graduate was $59,100, the 19th best starting salary in the nation and just behind the median salary for a recent graduate of Lehigh University, a highly selective private university in Bethlehem, Pa

    Business has moved into the Liberal Arts realm where they are suggesting having experience and a Post Graduate degree.
    They will always prefer a business grad from top ten schools for a business position over a liberal artiest what have you..and if you want to improve your chances have an MBA. What is your formal education if i may ask?

    Yes, he pointed this out in an earlier post.
    Thank you for bringing this important data to my attention.

    This was addressed as well.
    was it? department store was mentioned? you claim to like details and nit pick on them like a hungry crow.

    Yes, we are back to America vs. where you live
    Back? back from where? where did we go? and why vs?how does vs fits into this equation? i actually (the entire thread) assumed things are quite similar in this global world. So where do you bring this vs bs from? your feverish hateful brain?
  2. Devil is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/06/2012 10:03am

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    Quote Originally Posted by erezb View Post
    That isn't true, if you go to one of the top 10 business schools and graduate top 10 in your class, you are going to start high, and with a great salary.
    Some degrees prepare you nicely. You know, even starting as a middle manager in big department store isn't that bad. His dreams are simple enough.
    You're trying to string too many arguments together at once. Sure, if you earn an MBA from a top program you can get a management position somewhere. Fair enough. But what's the difference? Do you think this simpleton can get into Harvard?

    And do you really think Harvard MBAs go to work as middle managers in department stores?
  3. W. Rabbit is offline
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    You know me...the snakebite hiss, the Devil's Grip, the Iron Fist

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    Posted On:
    11/06/2012 10:51am

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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil View Post
    And do you really think Harvard MBAs go to work as middle managers in department stores?
    I do.

    You can find MBAs from all sorts of schools in all sorts of jobs these days.

    MBA was once one of those degree programs that offered limitless possibilities...marketed out the wazoo...then all the folks who realized they couldn't build a business with just book skills, but needed actual business skills...they went on to become admins and clerks and cashiers and fry cooks like everyone else who got a degree they couldn't use directly.

    I've seen a lot of MBAs trying to break into, for instance, computer or networking fields because business mgmt failed as a career track for them, and they think IT is (was) the next golden ticket...met a gym teacher who wanted to become Cisco-certified thinking it was a good segue to a new career...knew nothing about computers except that it was a "lucrative field".

    As mentioned previously in the thread the real "rock stars" making big bucks in technology are doing so because they've put a lot of time into their craft. In some cases a degree is important...I can't think of anything doing advanced VLSI design who doesn't also have a degree...

    But, it still looks good on a resume. Finishing a real degree (i.e. accredited) program shows you can actually sit down and accomplish something long-term and difficult (hard to show during a brief interview).
    Last edited by W. Rabbit; 11/06/2012 10:55am at .
  4. Devil is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/06/2012 10:58am

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    Quote Originally Posted by W. Rabbit View Post
    I do.

    You can find MBAs from all sorts of schools in all sorts of jobs these days.

    MBA was once one of those degree programs that offered limitless possibilities...marketed out the wazoo...then all the folks who realized they couldn't build a business with just book skills, but needed actual business skill...they went on to become admins and clerks and cashiers and fry cooks like everyone else who got a degree they couldn't use directly.

    I've seen a lot of MBAs trying to break into, for instance, computer or networking fields because business mgmt failed as a career track for them, and they think IT is (was) the next golden ticket...met a gym teacher who wanted to become Cisco-certified thinking it was a good segue to a new career...knew nothing about computers except that it was a "lucrative field".

    As mentioned previously in the thread the real "rock stars" making big bucks in technology are doing so because they've put a lot of time into their craft. In some cases a degree is important...I can't think of anything doing advanced VLSI design who doesn't also have a degree...

    But, it still looks good on a resume. Finishing a real degree (i.e. accredited) program shows you can actually sit down and accomplish something long-term and difficult (hard to do during an interview).
    No.

    I get resumes all the time from people with MBAs willing to do bullshit jobs. No surprise there. But not MBAs from top schools. Those people have invested too much in their future and are smart enough to know working retail will do nothing for their career advancement. I'm not saying they won't accept a lesser job than they'd hoped for, but you won't see a Harvard or Yale or Stanford or Duke MBA folding clothes at JC Penney unless they've developed a significant cocaine habit.

    Get real.
  5. W. Rabbit is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/06/2012 11:11am

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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil View Post
    But not MBAs from top schools. Those people have invested too much in their future
    You're being dualistic...assuming "those people" actually invested anything to get those "top shelf" degrees...in plenty of cases it was Mommy and Daddy doing all the work getting them there, or Grandpa was an alumnus. If they make the right connections at school...that means more than anything in the long term, aside from the paper degree. Look at George Bush Jr AND Al Gore... barely graduated from Yale/Harvard respectively, yet one became President, largely because his last name was "Bush", and the other was VP.

    A law professor of mine used to make an argument about Harvard lawyers (who statistically stay well employed) vs. all other lawyers (who fight for jobs). His argument was simple: Harvard lawyers stay on top because of the associations and alliances they make at Harvard...not because the degree is blessed.

    It's pretty easy to come from a privileged background, get accepted to a great school, have it all paid for without you having to work a day in your life, and then fall right into the mud with everyone else the moment you're on your own (if you weren't actually the motivated one).
    Last edited by W. Rabbit; 11/06/2012 11:15am at .
  6. erezb is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/06/2012 11:18am


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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil View Post
    No.

    I get resumes all the time from people with MBAs willing to do bullshit jobs. No surprise there. But not MBAs from top schools. Those people have invested too much in their future and are smart enough to know working retail will do nothing for their career advancement. I'm not saying they won't accept a lesser job than they'd hoped for, but you won't see a Harvard or Yale or Stanford or Duke MBA folding clothes at JC Penney unless they've developed a significant cocaine habit.

    Get real.
    I don't think one of those ivy league guys will work there, he does not have to. I was thinking OP will get a business degree, a BA and find a job somewhere...with a little more skill than when he just started. Good business programs are actually very efficient and realistic. I can think of way worst degrees, like biology, law etc. that are really not connected to what you end doing. If you need to choose who to promote when everything else is equal you will choose the one with an MBA,who was taught how to manage. I think an MBA is best coupled with something technical and is a tool to get ahead. it is also not specific so OP can get himself into which ever field he likes. Of course he needs a BA first.
    An MBA graduate from Duke will stream line and maximize the value of a cocaine enterprise before he folds cloths.
  7. Devil is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/06/2012 11:18am

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    Quote Originally Posted by W. Rabbit View Post
    You're being dualistic...assuming "those people" actually invested anything to get those "top shelf" degrees...in plenty of cases it was Mommy and Daddy doing all the work getting them there, or Grandpa was an alumnus. If they make the right connections at school...that means more than anything in the long term, aside from the paper degree. Look at George Bush Jr AND Al Gore... barely graduated from Yale/Harvard respectively, yet one became President, largely because his last name was "Bush", and the other was VP.

    A law professor of mine used to make an argument about Harvard lawyers (who statistically stay well employed) vs. all other lawyers (who fight for jobs). His argument was simple: Harvard lawyers stay on top because of the associations and alliances they make at Harvard...not because the degree is blessed.

    It's pretty easy to come from a privileged background, get accepted to a great school, have it all paid for without you having to work a day in your life, and then fall right into the mud with everyone else the moment you're on your own.

    Look man, if you want to use the outliers to create your rules of thumb, be my guest. By investment I meant time and effort, not money. I'm sure most students at Harvard don't pay for their own schooling just like most students elsewhere don't pay for their own schooling.

    The vast majority of students at those top schools are extremely bright and have spent their whole life kicking ass in school. They're not going to turn around and **** on themselves by working some dead end job.
  8. erezb is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/06/2012 11:38am


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    -1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by W. Rabbit View Post
    You're being dualistic...assuming "those people" actually invested anything to get those "top shelf" degrees...in plenty of cases it was Mommy and Daddy doing all the work getting them there, or Grandpa was an alumnus. If they make the right connections at school...that means more than anything in the long term, aside from the paper degree. Look at George Bush Jr AND Al Gore... barely graduated from Yale/Harvard respectively, yet one became President, largely because his last name was "Bush", and the other was VP.

    A law professor of mine used to make an argument about Harvard lawyers (who statistically stay well employed) vs. all other lawyers (who fight for jobs). His argument was simple: Harvard lawyers stay on top because of the associations and alliances they make at Harvard...not because the degree is blessed.

    It's pretty easy to come from a privileged background, get accepted to a great school, have it all paid for without you having to work a day in your life, and then fall right into the mud with everyone else the moment you're on your own (if you weren't actually the motivated one).
    not true, it is very hard to be born to a privileged family, you need good karma, second, don't forget the requirements to get excepted beside the money part, money that enables you to get the best prof. and programs. Finely the education they get with the environment of hard work they absorb, you get a well equipped guy.
  9. Devil is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/06/2012 11:41am

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    Quote Originally Posted by erezb View Post
    not true, it is very hard to be born to a privileged family, you need good karma, second, don't forget the requirements to get excepted beside the money part, money that enables you to get the best prof. and programs. Finely the education they get with the environment of hard work they absorb, you get a well equipped guy.

    Kindly refrain from agreeing with me in the future. I feel it detracts from my position.

    Sincerely,
    Devil
  10. erezb is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/06/2012 11:46am


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    Quote Originally Posted by Devil View Post
    Kindly refrain from agreeing with me in the future. I feel it detracts from my position.

    Sincerely,
    Devil
    The feelings are mutual, lets try and agree to disagree better next time. Or w.r needs to be less obviously in the wrong.
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